Alright, this has nothing to do with the whole Jeff Burton mad at Michael McDowell incident last week at Martinsville, I have a different complaint about lapped cars.
My complaint is that they still start to the inside of the leader on the restart. Why do they need to be there? We have the lucky-dog rule for lapped cars to catch up, they don't need to be up with the leaders messing up the race or even causing an accident. Back in the day that was good so you could make up a lap on a restart by getting by the leader and hoping for a quick caution, but with the free pass this isn't necessary.
Now, if you take those lapped cars out of the inside line and put them behind the lead lap cars... That opens a window of opportunity.
The All-Star Race has double-file restarts just like the starting grid (1st on the inside of row one, 2nd on the outside of row 1, etc.) providing for good racing throughout the entire race.
Well if you apply this to every race, maybe this could improve that issue that we've had with the middle of races being, well, boring. Normally a driver running, lets say, 4th would just start on the outside row with those lapped cars on the inside, lining him up virtually 8th, and by the time he's gotten around all the lapped cars he's several car lengths behind the leader. At that point, he's just going to ride and hope that the drivers in front of him have their car get away from them, but otherwise he's just going to ride and wait until later to make a move.
Now you take that same driver and use the same system you would in the All-Star race. Now that driver is actually lined up 4th, he can see the leader just outside his windsheild. He also sees the fourth place car just to his inside. Once the green flag drops, he's already trying to race for position, and he's all around cars doing the same, so he'll push harder to maintain and also to advance. Instead of finding himself far behind the leader once everything gets sorted out he maybe finds himself just a few tenths.
Now you have a better race through-and-through, and those lapped cars aren't changing the outcome, so long as they actually move out of the way when they around the leaders with 20 to go, but that's another story...
I like what you write here. One of the bigger issues I have with NASCAR is rewarding the teams who cannot stay with the leaders any other way. They have already made qualifying a joke, now when you cannot get your car up to speed, you get several opportunities to get back in a race when you cannot compete on the track. Lapped cars should start behind ALL of the cars on the lead lap no matter what weird pit strategy tells you they are competing still. The leader of the race should not have the lead stolen by a pit stop. You get rid of all the stupidity of getting lug nuts on wheels and gas in cars, if you cannot advance your team on a pit-stop. NASCAR has the ability to monitor the track position on yellows, and while they are driving around the track the inordinate amount of laps they always do on a yellow, they can get the teams sorted out before a start....just like the start of the race. The leader should get the pole period, and #2 can choose outside or behind the leader on the friggin paperclip tracks. NASCAR, you stink at being fair.
You have WON the Big Prize - Sanity. I have been saying this since they eliminated racing back to the caution flag. Well thought out. The "race" should be about who is the first lapped car aka the fastest to the line. I think this should even be modified to include cars that are more than one lap down. If you're faster, you are faster. But I also believe NASCAR should limit the amount of "lucky dog" passes a team can acheive in one race. Let's say two or three. Because being fortunate to stay on the lead lap should mean something, too.
NASCAR still sacrifices way too much in the name of preserving door-handle to door-handle racing with as many cars on the same lap as possible. I believe they err in assuming we can't handle/enjoy a race where superior cars are allowed to open up a lead over inferior cars, and let significantly inferior cars drop either a lap down or more - or leave the race due to an inability to continue at a decent speed.
Tylerhead24 - NASCAR knows the allstar race is the most exciting to watch and why. The local tracks reline them selfs to who they were racing at the time of yellows. I remember filming races at Lee USA Speedway and yellows come out with just a few laps togo.
They line them up doulbe and the 3rd place car now starting right behind the leader on the inside gone on to pass second place and even win, If they were lined like NASCAR they wouldn't have had a chance cause the leader would have bolted on the green.
I hate the lucky dog free pass. You do know your Jeff Gordon would have one less win or 2 if not if it was that way before. He came from 2or 3 laps down to win a race cause he got to line up with leader and out ran the leader till another yellow came out, that was with out the free pass.
Like Hanahan said its to easy for NASCAR to see it.
cheers
Yup, I remember that race, it was at Martinsville, he made up two laps and got the final one with the free pass. Came back to win from 3 laps down, on my birthday :) made me really happy, lol.
Good points Tyler. Shows you are thinking well. Personally I would like to see the lapped cars in the back of the pack and out of the leaders way. Makes sense to me.
Tyler, great post. This time, I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree with you!! I would even be in favor of single-file restarts, with the lead lap cars in front (much like the restarts with less than 10 laps to go). This makes WAY too much sense for the powers-that-be in NASCAR.
Ahh. Tyler, thats like teachin an old dog new tricks. It can be done. Will it...Hmm. Dont think that will happen. I like other fans think thats a good idea. Yet nascar should change since, like you stated with the lucky dog that only one car gets back a lap. Not like in the day of the leader backing off to let cars get a lap back..
nascars. FAIR is'nt that a oxymoron,i do like the restarts the way they are though, gives the bad luck cars a chance to get back on lead lap, the usual cars will drift to the rear and do the never on tv advertising, bring home a clean COT billboard
photogr- They should be out of the race, half of the time it spreads the leaders out so there is nothing to watch, everybody is just waiting for the next pit stop.
jon_464- lol, and yes, as least a single file restart would allow the leaders to race each other and not worry about lapped cars.
Last edited by tylerhead24 on April 4th at 6:47 AM.
I understand what you are saying tyler but you are forgetting another very important rule- you can only pass on the outside before the start/finish line on a restart. That wouldn't be very fair to the guys on the inside with your rule would it? They do that to prevent a cluster F... on restarts.
Everybody has a better way of doing things than what has been done for years. I like it the way it is and think we need to retain some of the traditions that has made nascar what it is. Nobody said it was going to be easy or fair. Nascar has changed enough as it is and needs to leave the rest alone. Maybe even return to some of the old ways on others such as the top 35 and qualifying. The old ways are what got all the fans here so lets leave things alone. I've heard people suggest heat races for qualifying. That is the way sprints, WOO, etc do it. Well this ain't sprints or the others, this is nascar, the top series in all of racing, leave it as it is and as it has been. These rules and procedures are what has separated nascar from the rest for all these years. Lets just race and let the other series do as they please. Not meaning to take anything away from the other series, just that cup is cup, not the others. Good post though.
Ok tyler, I understand your thinking but have a slightly different take on this. I grew up going to 1/2 mile dirt tracks in the midwest every weekend, and have attended several paved tracks also. Being a fan of this for several years (used to root for high groove harry) NASCAR has always restarted this way (save the downfinger rule.) My complaint is that when a yellow comes out and cars don't pit, they should restart at tail of lead lap, not be scored at tail of lead lap but restart in front of leader. If the lucky dog gets to go around and restart at tail end of lead lap so should all these guys. Whomever is first, be it from not pitting or winning race off pit road, should restart the race in the front of everyone else! Since we do not race back to the caution, lapped traffic (after yellow flag pit stops) should be lined up on the inside based upon actual position, not mixed by where they were on the track. (Example: multiple laps down being in front of single lap down cars)
Tyler, as bad as i hate to say this the sponcers{who have caused way to many changes} for nascar have payed to much $$$for their COT{bad mistake} to have the car leave the race, unless it cannot keep the required speed,or is a hazard for other cars. And for the single file start think how fast it would take for leaders to catch them that way
bluovl- With my rule I would hope that they would get rid of the passing on the outside only, because that wouldn't be fair, but I like what you say about keeping tradition, seems like Nascar has kind of lost that lately.
NomadMechanic- I don't get why they don't line up the lapped cars by position, it doesn't make sense. Why should a car that is three laps down have the advantage of trying to make up one over a car that is one lap down? Though I'd rather see them out of the way anyway, just my opinion lol.
runwhatyabrung- I don't want the lapped cars to leave the race, I just want them to be behind the lead lap cars on the restart and race amongst themselves.
You guys keep talking about tradition. Come on they took that out when they decided everybody got the same car and engine. Lets go back to run what ya brung and see how quick those lap cars fade in the rearview mirror.
I agree Tylerhead24. This has been one of my main complaints for a long time. As it is now, the leader and maybe 2nd drive away from the field while 3rd on back is stuck in lap traffic. Thats just idiotic. I am sure that most drivers would rather that the lap down cars were put back on the tail end of the lead lap as opposed to being up front a lap down. Theres a good reason that they are a lap down, and being up front with the leaders does not help them,really.
It would make for a much more exciting race to have the leaders up front alone to duke it out.
Also, nascar has changed the entire season to make it closer in the end, by resetting the points with 10 to go. Might as well use the same approach in each race.
I'm with bluovl, back to basics, put the right bodys on the COT, get back to racing. Seems you have a good head on your shoulder Tylerhead24 keep it up, maby watch some of the older races from 60s- 80s when you get a chance
runwhatyabrung, you must be an old f. a. r. t. like me. These kids don't know what they missed. That is good advice from runwh. Tyler. If you've never seen the old races and don't know who won they are very interesting. You may be surprised as to just how little things had changed until recent years. Enjoy!!!
A comment on McDowell's accident yesterday.
I haven't seen that bad of a crash in years. I'm glad Mike is still walking and driving. The problem I have is when is Nascar going to learn. To put it plan simple accident and debris clean ups still stink. That speedy dry cleanup was awafull. Speedy dry is like driving on loose marbles. Nascar get your act together on caution cleanups before a driver gets hurt or even killed.
Local tracks do a better job cleaning up wrecks. If a clean up is going to take several minutes then red flag the event so real race fans don't get cheated. I hope I don't see another bad wreck like Mike's yesterday, because of bad clean up jobs. Another thing still to many commercials. Have a nice day Nascar.
LRR
Last edited by lrichardson on April 5th at 11:18 AM.
I just don't understand why they let DW talk to drivers while they are in their cars. His questions to any of them are just plain stupid.
"How ya doing?" "What's your stratagy for the race today?" "Well DW, my stratagy is to race my butt off and win this damn thing."
Last edited by patches63 on April 6th at 11:43 AM.
I'm not sure about Speed Tyler. There is the show Back In The Day, and also ESPN classics shows the entire race most of the time. There are other sources too on the net if you want to pay for it. Might ask some of the fans here if they have copies they will share with you. Later.
This is about Jeff Gordan I have never seen such a quiter as he was Sunday especially being a so called champion. Tony, Kyle, and other drivers would run the the wheels off the car no matter how bad the car was handling. He reminds me of a pro NFL player just out for the money nothing more. He's not a die hard racer unless the car is perfect.
Hello, I'm Tyler Head. I live in Utica, NY and currently attend Ilion Jr. Sr. High School. I'm in 10th grade this year, and I'm persuing a career in Computer Hardware design, or Journalism... I guess I'm undecided, lol. I enjoy a lot of sports, with my favorite being NASCAR. My favorite driver is Jeff Gordon, I even made a fansite. As much as I enjoy NASCAR, I also like Baseball, Football, and College Basketball.
All articles from February 2008 on can also be found on my website, 24fansite.5u. com.
The All-Star Race has double-file restarts just like the starting grid (1st on the inside of row one, 2nd on the outside of row 1, etc.) providing for good racing throughout the entire race.
