I posted an article on Michelle Wie a month ago, but now that the golf season has officially begun I thought it appropriate to add a few comments and repost this article. With all of the attention to the plagiarism scandal, I wanted to post something else for the bloggers to comment upon. Tell me if you think I am wrong, but read my entire case against Michelle Wie before you condemn me. Also please understand that I think she is capable of winning should she compete at her level, the LPGA after going to college.
Michelle Wie is a phenomenal talent. If any woman should be allowed an exemption to play on the men’s tour, certainly she should qualify on the length of her drives. The problem with Michelle Wie, as I see it, is that she will never win a significant amount of tournaments to go into the LPGA hall of fame much less be remembered as a great golfer. She will be remembered as the teen golfing sensation that signed a lucrative endorsement deal with Sony and Nike but then fizzled after repeated attempts to win on the men’s tour. Here are 5 reasons in no particular order that I believe will make this all come true:
1. Michelle Wie is not a winner; Tiger is. The simple truth is that Michelle Wie has never really won anything. Oh, she won the pub links amateur once, but since then what has she won. Tiger won on every venue he could before going on to become a pro. He won the US Junior Amateur three times, the US Amateur three times, and finished with the NCAA title before turning pro. Do you think Tiger could have gotten exemptions to play on the PGA tour like Wie is doing now when he was 15 or 16. Of course he could, but learning to win on your own level is more important. After winning on the college level, ten times, at the age of 20 he become a professional, but not before he was a proven winner. Winning breeds winning. Losing, well, that breeds losing also. If Wie continues to compete against those that are far better than her, she will never feel the thrill of victory and get a taste as well as the experience she needs to mount a charge on a Sunday or hold on to a lead. For everyone who wants to compare the two, you cannot. They do not have the same approach to winning.
2. B.J. Wie: Tiger had Earl who instilled a love for the game in Tiger early. He also instilled discipline and many other wonderful virtues that are evident in Tiger’s Foundation. By the way, I am not a huge Tiger fan, but there is no comparison between the ways that Earl has raised his son to the way B.J. is raising Michelle. Earl hired the best caddies for Tiger and got out of the way. B.J. has been on the bag and clearly has no respect for other players.
3. The endorsements will dry up if Wie doesn’t win. Tiger signed a 60 million deal with Nike when he turned pro. Wie signed a 4-5 million dollar deal with the same company. A lot of money for sure for someone who has never really won an official PGA or LPGA tournament, or Asian tour, or Nationwide tour, or any tour that Wie has played on. I repeat, she has gone to all of these men’s tours, even the ones where it is the B and C caliber professional and lost. Wie will continue to get invites over the next few years, but as her novelty wears thin, she will lose those invitations and the endorsements will stop.
4. Commitment to one tour: Wie needs to commit to one tour. Winning on the PGA Tour is hard enough for the likes of Tiger. Today the talent level on the men’s tour is only getting better. Winning on the LPGA is also harder. Granted Annika makes it look easy, but after Annika there are the new kids on the block like Paula Creamer and all of the Park girls. The Koreans are taking the LPGA by storm and if Wie wants to win there, which is where she should be playing as a professional, but that is for the next post on Wie.
5. Hormones: Wie will eventually meet someone and get sidetracked with love. It happens to the men on the tour as well, and most of them have a drop-off in performance for a year or two until they get refocused to their craft, Tiger excluded. Wie is still very young and once the hormones kick in she will be dealing with all kinds of emotional issues besides her overbearing father and a lack of winning. Not to mention that she has not stopped growing and maturing physically as a woman. Her swing mechanics may change as her mammary glands grow.
I could be wrong, but I doubt it. I like Wie and I want her to win, but I personally think she has headed down the wrong path. Many teenage phenoms pup up each year on the men’s tour and most never reach the potential that is hyped upon them. Sergio Garcia was hyped as the next Tiger and certainly he is a very good golfer, but by now Tiger had 4 majors under his belt. Justin Rose, another good young English golfer who made his debut at the British Open as an amateur at 17 and was heralded as the next Nick Faldo. It has not materialized. Tiger is the only golfer who lived up to the hype, but he did not attempt to go pro until he was 20 and had won on every circuit below the pros. Who needs to win when you get 10 million in endorsements? Get used to seeing this face on Wie when she struggles year after year.
I couldn't agree with you more. Every aspect you touched on is absolute truth. Michelle Wie is nothing more than a publicity stunt by the PGA in my eyes.
When's Sue Bird going to join the Sonics, do you get my point?
Bold call on this socal. The hormone statement alone should have the women up in arms... I'm expecting carrie here five minutes ago...
I don't know that the Tiger comparison is fair. That's like saying will BJ Upton be a failure because he's not Derek Jeter.
Furthermore, the length of her drive should not be a reason she is invited to play on the men's tour. If this were the case, every guy in the long drive competiton would have a shot on the tour simply because they can knock the snot out of the ball, discounting the fact that they would be buried in the woods, pond, trap etc. right off the tee, because they have no accuracy.
Time will tell with Wie. No she is no Tiger. More importantly, she is not even close to Sorenstam. In fact, she is not even Morgan Pressel yet.
I like your take, but she would have been 8th on the money list for women had she been a professional last year. Given the limited number of tournaments she played due to age, I am impressed! I think this is a huge accomplishment. Also, there are hundreds of men who don't quite make the cut in the PGA. She has been very close already.
I don't think you need to win to breed winning. No one could win a first time if that were the case.
I do completely understand the worry about her physical development. You never know what could happen there.
Wouldn't you do the same if you were her father though. She was in her early teens. I'd be watching her like a hawk if I were him. She's getting older, perhaps his claws will slowly release their grasp as she matures.
Bad blog etiquette, dude. Your posts are good enough to not have to do that.
Interesting post, although none of us are seers, and I'm willing to give Wei some time. I completely agree, though, on picking one tour. She needs to focus.
Great post SoCal. Sorry I have been away from here the past few days. You've been up to doing your usual great stuff.
Didn't know much about Wie other than her age and her endorsements. Guess it is because she hasn't won much. Agree that the Tiger comparison may be a little unfair, but she definitely needs to prove herself a lot more than she has.
When I was in college, I used to play my roommate in chess. He was much better than me and consistently beat me. By the end of the term we were about even in wins. I got better because I played up to the competition. He remained the same. I think Wie will get better by playing up to the competition. Golf has a very large mental aspect to it so I believe the comparison is valid.
I disagree with the PGA wanting anything to do with this. I am willing to bet, they do not like this type of publicity. It makes them appear weak. She has done well, and will continue to do so.
Why not #### the millions while she can? It's all about the money anyway right? It's somewhat a contradiction you say she should wait then say her mammeries are gonna grow and screw her swing. Good post though.
Do you realize she is only 16 years old? Michelle Wie is the most freakish "athlete" (in quotes because she's a golfer) we've seen in the last 50 years. I only limit it to 50 years because I don't feel qualified to go earlier. She's is SO much further along at this age than Tiger was. Wie turned 16 in October. She would have been 8th on the money list, playing in limited tournaments. Tiger would have never made a cut when he was 15. Tiger would have finished dead last in every PGA tournament he played in when he was 15. Could Tiger have gotten exemptions to play on the PGA tour when he was 16? ABSOLUTELY NOT! No Way. He was busy winning his FIRST Junior Amateur. Not finishing 8th on the PGA tour money list. This comparison is HORRIBLE. I understand that there's something to be said for learning how to win, but Tiger Woods wasn't even in Michelle Wie's universe at the same age.
Sorry tree, it is a valid argument. Tiger was on the Johnny Carson show at 3 and had the most amazing swing at that age. His dad realized what a talent he was and allowed his son to develop with his competition and win. Wie has never had an opportunity to win. She is amazing at 15 almost 16 and could be the best ever. Golf is mental as much as physical and anyone who sees how devastating the losses have been to Justin Rose and other young talents knows this. Wie can take the millions now, but endorsements will dry up if she cannot compete with her own peers. Could have been 8th, she wasn't 8th. Forget that comparison until she plays for real. Annika Sorenstam is for real. Wie could be, but later on, she will be old news as the next 13 year old phenom comes along.
Quick question. Who was the last 15 year old phenom who was the 8th best at his/her sport in the world? Answer: It's never happened before. (Actually, I don't know about gymnastics) The next 13 year old phenom like Michelle Wie isn't going to come around every year. Freddy Adu? He's a few months older than Wie, and a few hundred spots behind her in his sport's best players list. Michelle Wie just did something last year that's unprecedented in the history of sports. Tiger Woods wasn't in the top 1000 golfers in the world when he ws 15. Michelle Wie was #8. Actually, probably better. She didn't play a full schedule on the LPGA so her earnings are deflated. I understand that there's something to be said for learning how to win, but you just CAN NOT compare any other athlete as even close to Wie's equal at her age. No one has EVER had the success in an individual sport that Wie has at her age. She's not just another child phenom. She's the greatest child phenom the world has ever seen up to this point. the next Michelle Wie isn't just going to come around every couple of years.
I agree to a certain extent. She probably will not live up to the hype as not many do, but I do believe she can make a fair living playing golf. She will win some tournaments as she has the talent to win a tournament. Golf is about being on that week or day. She may not live up to the hype that she is given, but she will probably make more money playing golf then all of us combined working.
Right Tree, Tiger's dad had him winning on his own level. Had he entered those tourny's that Michelle is playing he may have ended up like her. All hype and no wins. I repeat, no wins! She did not finish 8th because she was not a professional and did not earn anything. Secondly, yes Drizzo, she will earn and has earned in endorsements alone more than you or I will ever make, but she will not get return endorsements if she cannot win. Look no further than tennis star Monica Seles. The best in her game but after injuries and not being able to win, all the endorsement money went away. Wie is a phenom to be sure, but even phenoms need to produce results. If she chooses to stay on the men's tour, she will possibly win one, maybe two tourny's in her career. Earn a living, yes, be a superstar who will be remembered, no. Annika has 50+ victories, Wie, none.
This is definitely an odd career path for Wie. I would not compare her to Tiger at all. But clearly, her focus is not to be known as the best women's golfer. It is to do something that no woman has ever done...be successful on the PGA tour.
Again, her age. Unless you are Tiger Woods, there is no way you could seriously contend at that age. With patience, she will be great. She is playing against people better than her...which should ultimately make her better. Not ready to win yet...But wait.
socal, great point: Annika has 50+ victories. She's 35 years old! Did you fail to realize that. Wie really sucks for not winning a professional tournament before she could legally drive a car. How can you possibly write her off like this. You are making one of the most absurd claims I have ever heard. THe fact that she didn't win a professional tournament as a 14 or 15 year old makes you think she won't win more than a couple in her career? You discredit the fact that she was a top ten player on the LPGA because she wasn't officially a professional. Sorry Socal, that's just plain stupid.
I believe if Wie turned her focus away from trying to make a PGA Tour cut, she'd excel on the LPGA Tour, which I guess goes in line with one of your five points.
However, it's not really fair to compare her, or anyone, to Tiger. Tiger is a once in a lifetime athlete (yes, he IS an athlete) and should never be used a standard barrer for every young up-and-comer in golf.
I'll reserve judgment on Michelle Wie until she's well into her 20's.
Tree read what I said. She will never win more than one or two in her career on the men's tour. On the women's tour I believe she could be the greatest if she dedicates herself to one tour. I also think the right path would be to put the fear of God in everyone by winning all those ams and college. That is what Tiger did. Everyone was worried about when he was coming out and how he would dominate the tour. The women are just mad at Wie for essentially slapping them in the face and saying "you are not worthy." She hasn't beaten Morgan Pressel, Paula Creamer, or Annika. Forget the Davies and Se Ri Pak and others.
Find your facts first tree. She has never won, but the others have. Pressel just won the amateur and Creamer won twice last year. Wie has not won a single tournament since she was 13. Finishing second does no good it doesnt' go into the record books. http://golfserv.foxsports.com/gdc/t ourcentral/stor
y.asp?StoryList=lpga_leader;2;5 &tour=LPGA
Where are your posts tree? No bio, no posts, I see a pattern.
Last edited by socalsportsfan on January 10th at 2:26 PM.
I agree, that whe is going to mess things up for herself the way she is going. She should have played the men's tour once or twice and then gone back to the LPGA. On the LPGA she is good enough to contend week in and week out, and build confidence in her game by playing well. She is going o make a lot of money either way, but like you pointed out the path she is on is going to be the shorter and less profitable one.
I understand your points why she won't be a great golfer, but if you could please enlighten me on another 16 year old that you can state has a better chance of being a great golfer. There are always so many reasons why someone won't be great, but there is also so many reasons why they will be great. I know she didn't win any tournaments last year or that maybe she is heading down the wrong path, but you really can not say she won't be great. There are only a few sports figure that really live up to the hype right away. Give her time and she may prove your wrong or right, but currently she is the young player with the best chance to be great. If you look at Kevin Garnett when he first came into the league, there was a ton of reason that he could fail, but he didn't. I'm not putting Wie in the hall of fame, but right now she is the future of women's golf.
I have my facts Socal, maybe you should find your's. You said Wie has never beaten Pressel, Creamer, or Annika. By finishing ahead of each of them in LPGA tornaments, she HAS beaten them. You don't have to win a tournament to beat another player buddy. That's like saying the second place finisher in a race didn't beat the third place finisher. Hmmmmmm, you're making no sense once again. Do I see a theme developing?
Last edited by treerollins2 on January 10th at 2:26 PM.
She did not beat them tree, but I will just agree to disagree with you. You are obviously a teen infatuated with Wie and cannot think clearly.
Drizzo, I am not writing her off. I think she can be the greatest woman golfer of all time if she changes directions, but if she stays on this path, I think she is destined to be spoken of in the past tense. Always what could have been. She is the best at her age if she plays there, but not the best woman golfer right now, that belongs to Annika, the best man is Tiger, and the best Senior is up for debate. I rest my case guys, when she wins a tournament, post it and I will write a post singing your praises for all being right and me being wrong. But I can and will post my thoughts and that is what a blog is for. I can write her off if I so choose.
Last edited by socalsportsfan on January 10th at 3:01 PM.
Socal
Don't take offense...just stating my point as to why I think she will be a great golfer. Maybe not the best as Annika could make it really hard, but I think she will be a great golfer. I agree with some of your points on her paths as it is quite hard for someone so young to face the pressure of professional competition. Even with all the adveristy that she may face I still believe she will be a great golfer. I am not on the offensive when making my comments. Just debating my thoughts and my opinions.
Just curious. Is there a comparable case of a male player that age with that kind of buildup who fell apart as a pro? Can't think of one offhand.
There are plenty of tennis players who turn pro young and prosper. I guess I would be more suprised if she doesn't win some tournaments along the way. She's so far ahead of her peers.
Dudski,
Ty Tryon was the youngest male to ever make a cut when he did that in 2001 at the Honda CLassic. He was 16. He later turned pro and tried to make it through tour school and earn his card. I think he was the youngest to earn his card. He did finish 39th in that tourny but as an amatuer he could not take any money. He had high hopes and was talked into going into the pros and foregoing college. He now makes a living shining shoes. Actually, I made that up, but he plays on the nationwide and has yet to win on the pga. I do believe he won this year on the nationwide collecting 11,000. He got a lot of exposure for those who followed golf, but because he wasn't competing agains the opposite sex as Wie is attempting, it isn't that big of a deal. Also, Tiger was much heralded and exceeded expectations, but he did it right.http://www.pgatour.com/player s/intro/285350
Last edited by socalsportsfan on January 10th at 4:52 PM.
dudski, though not in golf, i can think of two off the top of my head:
Donald Young, tennis- Young, now 16 years old, turned pro when he was 14 and said his goal was to win "all the Slams twice". Big things were expected from him and pressure was put on him from the USTA as they wanted a successful black tennis player to help their image. Young was given numerous wild cards into tournaments last year but lost every time, failing to even win a set. The sad thing is, everybody is writing the kid off. Young strikes the ball like few before him have, you can tell he is a special talent. He also ended the year ranked #1 in the world in the juniors category, which is very remarkable for a 16 year old. Like Wie, there is so much pressure on him now that it looks like no matter what he does, if he doesn't win a Major, he will be labeled a bust.
the second one is Freddy Adu- I'm sure you are much more familiar with Adu's story. Like Young and Wie, he is labeled as more hype than substance. But he is incredibly talented. At just 16, Adu has been granted an invite to the US National Team camp. That is impressive. But to the casual fan, Adu isn't scoring a hat trick per game, so he must be a bust. Adu is immensely talented, and has a lot of time to improve. He has shown signs of immaturity, but people must remember that he is extremely young.
Norcal. I am not going to be rude here, but if you don't have time to read through the comments on my page, is that my problem? Also, I won't tell you what to blog about if you promise not to tell me what to blog about. If I choose to write about Wie, which as I stated this is a repost from Dec. (check my archives) I will write about it. I really was offended by that comment.
Norcalfella
Jan 10, 2006
6:50 PM socal - I really have no time to read through this entire list of comments. However, it should be noted that on your other post I made my stance known. You should lay off Wie. She is a very talented golfer with quite possibly a bright future. When you jump on her it feels very negative to me as a reader and sports fan. I am not sure this is how you want to portray yourself to others.
Last edited by socalsportsfan on January 10th at 7:23 PM.
Interesting argument Socal. I think you're wrong though. Like any teen phenom, Wie could fizzle, but that's the case with anything. But I think moreso than any sport, golf is not about a mentality of winning. After all, you're really only competing against the course, not against others.
I remember when the Williams sisters in tennis took a while to adjust to the competition of the WTA, their father was criticized for not letting them play in amateur competition to learn how to win. Of course things ended up working out for those two, but I still think that's a more valid argument for tennis than golf. In golf, she's just got to play the best she can. Sure learning to win might make her better able to handle the pressure and not crack like many phenoms do, but Wie is already living in the spotlight under tremendous pressure and doing fine. She's tremendous physically for a 16 year old, but also amazingly composed mentally. I think she has a chance to be a Tiger for women and will win plenty on the WPGA.
Last edited by noahpinto on January 10th at 10:14 PM.
Norcal-I see your side on the Wie argument that we, as bloggers, should not pick on her because she is just a kid. On the other hand, there is a price you pay for being in the public spotlight and everyone is entitled to their opinion. You came across a little harsh, but I actually believe you did not mean it the way it sounded.
Socal-I think Norcal may have come across the wrong way here. I honestly feel that he is a big fan of yours and just chose the wrong way to address a blog that he doesn't agree with. He has told me personally that he likes your work. I don't think it is something to be offended by because he just disagreed with one blog. I believe he supported most of your other blogs. I agree, he could have said it in a different way, but there is no going back now. Lord knows I have had my fair share of people not like my stuff, but it doesn't change how I look at them. I hope this helps ease this little argument a little bit because I really believe Norcal likes you as a writer, just not this one blog.
rlb, you may be right. I was tired last night and when I saw Norcal's comments saying "lay off Wie" it landed on the wrong side in my brain. I have said over and over that I hope Wie makes it. I am a fan of all great golfers. I just hate to see her potential wasted, and I do believe it is being squandered by a greedy father. If I am wrong, that is what opinions are all about. It is just mine. I felt badly about some of my comments to Norcal last night and I erased the entire strip of rebuttals and left the one original in my response so that I could be fair to his first comment. His other comments are still in my original post from last month. This post was supposed to be a distraction from all of the plagiarism stuff and it made it to the top of MFB. Thanks for all of your comments rlb. I do like Norcals work too.
Look, I know you've written some supportive comments on my blog, so I don't want to come off rudely, but you talk about the Right Way more than Herm Edwards or Larry Brown, yet you put a post in the category of NFL and NASCAR just to keep it on the list longer? That's a little hypocritical, don't you think? And I noticed someone else said something earlier about this being in the NFL section and you said it would be off soon, when in reality you can edit those.
A good post, but when you start getting upset with others (though we've all got faults, including me) for what they say or how they post, maybe you should think about your own blogging tactics as well.
Last edited by MooreSports on January 11th at 11:10 AM.
Moore, I am sorry if that practice offends you and I do not think that I have ever complained about it in anyone else's blog because it would be hypocritical of me if I did so. What I have complained about is grammar, poor blogs, but not how and when it is posted or what you choose to write. I have complained about writing one sentence and a link. Yes, I have used multiple headings as do the NGS judges to get something noticed. I am hardly the only one that does that so I honestly do not think I have ever criticized anyone for doing that. There is no Golf or Tennis headline yet for people to see. The tech side of Fox says they will do something, but until then I plan on listing most things as NFL first and then another topic. My title tells you what it is about, so no one has to read it unless they like it and want too. I think that is fair, but if I have offended you , I am sorry.
Last edited by socalsportsfan on January 11th at 11:41 AM.
Do you have a real job?
You are incredibly boring and certainly provide no insight.
Why not take up a cause like NASCAR competitors being required to use left turn signals.
Take a break, Socal; you haven't had an original thought in your life.
I fully agree that she should compete within her league. I do not think she can perform at her potential when competing with the men. There is no doubt in my mind she could perform very well and build her confidence with the LPGA. Come on Wie, show us what you are made of.
Obsessively trying to make cuts in men's event is ruining her game. Michelle may be a long hitter for women, but she is rather short compared to an average PGA pro. in 2006, her driving distance average of 274.5 yards would have ranked her 191st in PGA Tour. Not bad for a 16-year-old girl, but certainly far from good enough on long courses. If you have played golf at all, you know what happens when you drive too short; you end up hitting longer irons into greens, a recipe for disaster. Common sense would tell you Michelle Wie might be trying to muscle the ball farther. And again, if you play golf, you know what happens then; your whole game goes down the drain when you try too hard. Unfortunately for her, this is a never ending vicious cycle as she plays in men's events. Hit it too short, she can't compete; try to hit it too hard, games goes AWOL.
I could be wrong, but I doubt it. I like Wie and I want her to win, but I personally think she has headed down the wrong path. Many teenage phenoms pup up each year on the men’s tour and most never reach the potential that is hyped upon them. Sergio Garcia was hyped as the next Tiger and certainly he is a very good golfer, but by now Tiger had 4 majors under his belt. Justin Rose, another good young English golfer who made his debut at the British Open as an amateur at 17 and was heralded as the next Nick Faldo. It has not materialized. Tiger is the only golfer who lived up to the hype, but he did not attempt to go pro until he was 20 and had won on every circuit below the pros. Who needs to win when you get 10 million in endorsements? Get used to seeing this face on Wie when she struggles year after year.
