What scares me, though, is the fact that there are about 29 other General Managers that are going to try to SELL him several of the aforementioned commodity before the MLB Winter Meetings end on Thursday of this week.
Why my trepidation, you might well ask? Let me see, there is last year's perfectly awful Horacio Ramirez for Rafael Soriano deal. The Braves get one of the better setup men in the League, and the M's get--you guessed it--an oft injured pitcher who can never win on the road, and only occasionally at home, with a 7+ ERA. Then there was the mostly failed Jeff Weaver experiment--who is going to benefit from that this year, now that he is no longer in Seattle blue? (Of course, I would be more than happy if someone just kind of sent his brother up here, but we all know that ain't gonna happen either).
Then there is the fact that he/the M's front office did absolutely NOTHING at the trade deadline--a time at which the M's were actually in contention for the AL West, and after which they slid back down to second, never to recover. (Yes, I know that they won more games last year than they have since 2003 but that is really beside the point, now, isn't it?)
Rumors/leaks went out over the past week or so that the Mariners had discussed a Johan Santana trade with the Twins. And they probably did, but they had to have known what everyone else seems to know--Santana has a full no trade clause, and he wants to go to the AL East, not West. Besides, who were they going to give up to the Twins for Santana? Felix Hernandez? I think NOT. So that was a pretty useless conversation, especially if it lasted more than two minutes. (And don't get me wrong here, I can salivate over the prospect of a Santana/Hernandez one two in the rotation as much as the next person, but I'm also sane enough to know that it wasn't going to happen).
Kuroda, anyone? Those who are in the know say that the soon to be 32 year old Japanese pitcher projects to be no better than a middle of the rotation starter, and would probably be better of in the NL than the AL (see Matsuzaka, Daisuke under the subheading "not quite as good as advertised for the monies paid out"). So the M's offer him 4 years/$45MM. I say they would be better off giving (and I do mean GIVING) Richie Sexson to the Giants, along with maybe Wladimir Balientien and Rob Johnson, and bringing Tim Lincecum home to pitch. Less salary, younger, hometown boy, and the probability of being able to fix those funky mechanics under the stern tutelage of new pitching coach Mel Stottlemyre.
Eric Bedard is not going to come cheap, and I'm not sure Andy McPhail wants much, if anything, that good ole Bill could/would offer him in return. Same for the former Seattle Pilots and Ben Sheets.
The Cubs are said to be interested in left fielder Raul Ibanez, but only to convert him to a right fielder (see Soriano, Alfonso under the subheading large contract and "heck, no, I ain't moving out of left field"). What would the M's get in return? I'm hearing Mark Prior. Doesn't he have a glass arm? Raul may be losing a step or two with his bad back and bad hammy from last season and he doesn't have the strongest arm from left field, but he is a left handed batter who can still more or less hit, particularly with the short right field porch at the Safe.
Despite my early thoughts to the contrary, both Jose Guillen and Jose Vidro were good pickups for the M's last season, but Guillen is now gone, so that takes 20+ HR's and 100+ RBI off of the game for this year. Vidro is not exactly comfortable in the DH role, and his knees won't let him play the field consistently. So, I guess that I have to give Herr Bavasi credit for those.
In short, Bill, wise up this winter. DON'T come home with a bunch of broken down vets who probably can't get it done at Safeco Field. If you can't come home with at least one good, young top of the rotation pitcher, then don't come home with anyone. Start using those good young arms that are waiting in the wings. Brandon Morrow, Ryan Rowland-Smith, Sean Green and the other 20 somethings will be ready in another year. Don't mortgage or trade away the future for someone(s) that are not going to put a winning product on the field come spring.
I don't like the team not winning, but there are young players in the system who will get better if allowed to develop here and not be traded away for player or players who really aren't going to help.
Restrain yourself this year, OK? (Fukudome, though, you could come home with and we would be at least a little happy about that).
Nice blog. When i look at the Mariners, i cant help but see an immediate regression coming up in 08. Its not just the whole poor run differential thing. They simply dont have that much offensive firepower outside of Ibanez and Ichiro, and if Ibanez goes, well that just leaves Ichiro. They dont have good enough starting pitching to get through the sixth inning with the lead and allow their tremendous bullpen to take over.
Chitown: Yep, exactly. The reason for their slide last year fell squarely onto Washburn, Ramirez and Weaver not being able to get beyond the fourth or fifth innings more often than not. The pen was one of their greatest assets and they just burned them all out.
Good news is that Mark Lowe is looking good in his progress with rehab, and Morrow is doing pretty well in the beginnings of his conversion to starting, but they won't either of them really be ready for the rotation before '09 at the earliest. I have resigned myself to at least one more losing year, but I don't like it, not one bit.
Hi Sleepless, and to answer your question, I wouldn't buy a used BASEBALL from him.
Now listen, you need to cheer up a little. Hot stove season is the time for boundless optimism and unrealistic expectations, right? You're sounding like you've contracted a case of midseason blues here...
And you have more brains, too. For someone from a family with such an "illustrious" baseball history, he sure didn't get any of the smart baseball genes...
Yes, I fear that is, at least, partially true. The balance was for his ablity to nod his head and say "yes sir" when told to do something stupid by the CEO.
Sleepless, I'd love to see you guys challenge the ANAHEIM Angels next season. Seems to me the Mariners need a dependable #3 or #4 starter that can eat up innings like Pac-Man.
Jon: Now that the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, Azusa, Cucamonga and all points east did not get Cabrera like they hoped they would, I suppose that anything is possible, though I'm not sure how possible. They really need a solid number one, until Felix is really ready. One can always hope, right?
"Then there is the fact that he/the M's front office did absolutely NOTHING at the trade deadline"
"Don't mortgage or trade away the future for someone(s) that are not going to put a winning product on the field come spring."
Which is it? Unless you have a side career in politics going, would you care to explain this to me?
And even if you're saying the offseason and trade deadline are different things, it doesn't matter. Quality is still quality. You're saying you would have traded Jeff Clement for Al Reyes? Good grief! Heathcliff Slocumb on line 1!
I'm guessing by that last quote you also were referring to Vidro, who you probably had your arm twisted to admit he had a decent season. Chris Snelling is, you might have noticed, now on his fourth different team SINCE the trade. Some future............
And have I missed something but when were they NOT using Morrow, Green, or RRS last year? Only youngster that WASN'T being used was Adam Jones, who now won't have that problem now that Jose the Cancerman is gone.
Don't try and sell me that the M's are going to start losing again now that he's gone. If you're subtracting two pitchers from the rotation that helped the M's lose games (although Ramirez didn't to the degree of Weaver) and possibly upgrading how can that be a step backward? And if AJ can start to show the Torii Hunter-potential every scout says he has, where's the regression there? Now that he's going to be getting more than sub-2 ABs per game....................
Last edited by Handler on December 5th at 6:57 PM.
Vidro DID have a good season. Along with Guillen, these were the two decent moves of last offseason. They made NO trades by either the 31 July non-waiver or the 31 Aug non-waiver deadlines, either of impact or non-impact players.
Ramirez is NOT gone, unless they non-tender him. Mr. Bavasi feels that he can be "rehabilitated" by the new pitching coach. Personally, I'm not going to hold my breath. If Leo Mazzone couldn't do anything with him, Mel Stottlemyre probably won't be able to either.
If they make ANY quality trades during the Winter Meetings, Adam Jones will be gone, as may Clement, Morrow and/or Balentien, because they are what is being demanded in return for the pitchers that they are pursuing. If he is traded, he won't be seen out in center field this season,, now will he? And they will be forced to replace him. With whom? Andruw Jones? Aaron Rowand? Someone else, such as whom?
Granted, most of the divisional rivals, other than LAA, have not done anything much to improve so far this offseason, either. But the teams that the M's would have to compete against for the wild card (assuming that the Angels take the division again) HAVE. If you want to compete against them, you have to improve, and they have not.
Way to not answer my question, you don't want to trade young players, or you do, which is it? Were you for it before you were against it too?
And btw if the M's nab say both Bedard and Kuroda, ####-Ram's out of the rotation--I didn't say off the team. He has good value out of the pen. And btw Ramirez did in fact prosper under Leo, he went 200 IP in '05 when he was healthy. He's never had a good K/BB ratio true, but that can be overrated. Outs are outs, and baserunners allowed are baserunners allowed.
This is why I can't take "the plight of long-suffering M's fans" seriously. Frequent flip-flops, contradicting logic, and analysis developed solely from not only reading box scores and stat sheets but from the Dayn Perrys of the world as well.
Pre-game Mike HartCentral Florida has the NCAA's rushing leader, Kevin Smith. Smith has rushed for 2,448 yards this season, and he needs 181 yards to be officially recognized as the NCAA's single season record holder. Barry Sanders currently owns the record, with 2,628 yards in 1988 when he was at Oklahoma State. That was back when the NCAA did not count bowl games as part of the total stats for a season. So Sanders accumulated that yardage in just 11 games. If you added Sanders' yardage from the Holiday Bowl that year (222), he would have 2,850 yards in 12 games. Would it be right to call Smith the record-holder since he will have played in 14 games? I don't think so.
If I thow a stick will you go away. You have posted the same lame comment on over a dozen blogs that I have read today. We read it. Got a point to make, post your own blog!
Something everyone should notice from trading pitcher with the Braves. Sheurholtz is a genius when evaluating young talent. If he is letting him go, there is something he sees that makes him think the kid will be a flash-in-the-pan.
I do agree with you that your current GM has the tendancy to "sell the farm" for a few questionable veterans in order to try to win now instead of building a consistent winner for the future.
Dashman: No question that the Braves got the better end of the Soriano/Ramirez deal, by far. What is irritating, on top of it, is that Silly Billy thinks that all it is going to take to fix HoRam this year is his working with Mel Stottlemyre. Yeah, right. Even Mel can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse.
Doesn't Bavasi look a little bit like Chertoff and look on how he is running homeland security getting it all #### up to it makes me wonder if they are related.
I am a 50 something health care professional transplanted to Seattle from SoCal in 2001 (and, before you ask, no, I don't want to go back). My tastes in sports are pretty eclectic, but in order of preference, I guess they would be baseball, hockey, basketball, football--col lege and pro/men and women alike. Teams I "HATE": USC (I went to UCLA); University of Michigan (born and raised in Columbus OH to a large family of OSU alumni/alumna e), and--probably most of all--the d***ed Yankees. I have worked in a variety of capacities at the MLB, NBA and NFL venues here in Seattle and at UW (hey, what true sports fan could pass up the possibility of getting paid to do something you would have done anyway (and had to pay for it)?)
