Talking to ESPN Radio's Dan Patrick, Michael Irvin said that Tony Romo's stellar play might be attributable, not to talent and hard work, but to black heritage. Irvin suggested there might have been "some brother down in that line somewhere." Since Romo is almost as white as I am, it is possible that Irvin was joking. But Patrick apparently didn't think so and asked Irvin if black heritage was mandatory for athletic prowess. "That's not the only way, but it's certainly one way," Irvin replied. "If great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandma pulled one of them studs up out of the barn ... `Come on in here for a second,' you know ... " Joke or not, by my count, that's offensive to blacks, whites, grandmothers and humanity in general. And if it was a joke, it's as unfunny as that Michael Richards' tirade. At this point, Irvin and ESPN have been silent on the issue though one hopes that Irvin will issue an apology on Sunday's NFL pre-game show. And let's hope it's not one of those phony "if I offended anyone" apologies. But the networks who hire people like Irvin are the ones who should be apologizing, and not just ESPN
By these comments I would say that Irvin is a racist and that ESPN should fire him. This matter is no different then Rush Limbaugh’s comments regarding Donavan McNabb and is just one of many idiotic comments made by the former cowboys receiver. What do you think?
Irvin was clearly joking. But many people could be easily offended by this comment. He won't be fired and I'm not sure that he should. What Rush said was very serious, that McNabb was overrated because the media wanted a black QB to win the Super Bowl.
What Irvin said was simply stupid and was a joke, granted if it was a white guy making a comment about a black player like that he'd be fired before the story was published. Regardless, I think it was a joke and Irvin should be fired for his lack of neutrality not his other dumb comments.
Joke or not Irvin says some idiotic things all the time. He should not be an analyst, but not for racist remarks, but because he is just plain bad at it.
Michael Irvin is a MORAN!!! Maybe Michael Irvin's stupidity can be attributed to the fact he took one too many basket weaving classes at "THE U" and one to many hits from his pipe. Get him off the air already he's an ####.
Man you are just dumb and a hater, this is the same kind of comment as if a white guy says he can't jump because he is white. The problem is that this comment would have been fine if they were not on the air, but like you said people could be offended.
Reverse-Racism cut and dry. He was saying Tony Romo has to have black in him to be that athletic? That's not racist? Oh that's right it is just a joke, of course. He constantly says things like this and he is never held accountable. Come on when is ESPN or the NFL going to do something? I want to see a white commentator say something along those lines and see what happens?
Last edited by aaron rowand on November 27th at 10:30 AM.
I don't know if it can be called racism, but it clearly was inappropriate whether he said on the air or off doesn't matter. Thus, he should apologize for the remarks. Demon, you seem to always want to stick up for Michael Irvin; do you think he is that good of an analyst?
Another stupid and rather inappropriate comment coming from an athlete who hasn't really mastered the English language to any great effect. Hence the reason he's put in an analyst's booth and not providing game time commnetary. Stupid is as stupid does !
rampant/tophatal.....
Last edited by rampantfanatic on November 27th at 12:07 PM.
Irvin will not be held accountable. He will sluff it off as a "joke" and that will be the end of it. Or he'll give the obligatory apology (sorry if I offended anyone.......)
There is a word for this but it's not racism.
It's stupidity. In today's ridiculous PC world, you can't say anything like that without expecting a backlash!
What he said would be judged as far more offensive that what Steve Lyons said to Lou Piniella and Lyons got fired. What he said is also in the same line as what Jimmy the Greek said about slaves being bred specifically for a purpose (which was 100% correct) and he got launched too!
Irvin is yet another beneficiary of the ridiculous racial double standard in the media.
To the objective observer, Irvin's remarks are equally incendiary to those of Limbaugh, no more, no less. Just as Limbaugh said years back, the media is desperately willing to look past any transgressions or underperformance by black athletes (or announcers) as a measure to atone for the "sins of the fathers".
It's a sickening, perverse perspective but it pervades the media as much as any single practice.
Jake Plummer flips off the crowd surreptitiously and gets media coverage for weeks. But Mike Vick raises both middle fingers high to the Georgia Dome and for some reason, ESPN doesn't even mention it.
It's disgraceful that the media acts as though the effects of racism are the sole domain of blacks.
It's the difference between politics and sports/sphere of influence/expectations. Although not fair according to precedence set in the Rush Limbaugh incident, I expect Irvin to keep his job. Although if the masses apply enough pressure on ESPN, I could be wrong. It's kind of like boycotting the national championship game, raise a stink and you may be surprised what happens.
chris i agree with your idea but i think your conclusion is wrong: it seems ok because people (the media) expects the 'thug' players to act like that. if it were Donovan McNabb or one of the 'company men' it'd've been a huge story. but no one respects mike vick. he's like the allen iverson of football.
this is also an instance of Irvin repeating something he might say around his 'black friends' that he should never say in public. its always uncomfortable. it also goes both ways. my white friends have inadvertently said things to me that they figured would be ok, not realizing how hurtful the words were.
Last edited by demonicume on November 27th at 2:52 PM.
you guys can sit and point the finger all you want but when it comes right down to it. You may not have said the things Irvin did (though by reading what he said he was clearly joking) you've thought it more times then you remember or even think about becuase it's just human nature. I'll let you throw stones at me if you let me throw stones at you first because we all know that we're just the perfect beings in every way shape and form never ever EVER degradding anyone for anything they've done or said. Make a crack 'bout a fat chic imo it's just as bad as racism and I do it all the time sadly enough.
Here is my main problem, when a white person comments on another race/ethnicity a big deal is made of it, no matter what the circumstance. However, when Irvin says it, it was clearly a joke, so that makes it alright. One poster said it was a joke, so by that rational the Michael Richards rant was just a joke also. Irvin’s comments basically say that there are no good white athletes. What if I was on the radio and stated that there were no smart black men and if they did exist it was because some white master stud took a slave around back while his wife was not looking. If a white man said that on the radio he would be fired from any position that he had. I wish that things were not so politically correct, but if society is going to act this way then it must be equal on both sides.
Michael Richards comments were no accident. I was absolutely dumbfounded by the hatred and vitriol he was spewing. While there's no question Richards is a bitter, frustrated, shell of the one trick pony he was on Seinfeld, there's no question that a single embarassing situation does not expose such a character component.
In short, Richards saying he's really not a racist is like me saying I think Bill Cowher's a genius. (I'm on record as placing Cowher right between neanderthal and cro-magnon man on the IQ list).
The fact that we say things in racially similar company that we would not say in diverse company is only an indicator of our ability to manage our interactions, not our feelings. It doesn't change what we are, it changes what we say.
Richards is frighteningly racist, to the point of wishing hurt on others. His outburst was no accident and his words were too quickly delivered to be anything more than automatic.
Irvin is a racist. That has been abundantly clear by his blatantly african-american slanted viewpoints from jump street. It appears though, he's a good bit more convivial about it.
Some label Irvin's goof, reverse discrimination. But there's no such thing as reverse-discrimination. Discrimination is a multi-directional affect. There are no excuses for racial bias and no get out of racism free cards just because one is black.
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck . . . . .
Here's the problem with letting someone get away with remarks like that when no white person could get away with it. We're supposed to be still striving for EQUALITY. As far as I can determine equality means EQUAL. I have heard it said many times that "only a white person can be racist because only whites opressed other races". Any reasonably intelligent person knows that blacks are being opressed by other blacks in Africa today. And that women are being opressed by men all over the world. And that people are being opressed everywhere you turn in the name of religion regardless of what name you give your God.
If we are ever to achieve equality ALL races, ALL religions and ALL sexes are going to have to accept that RACISM AND OPRESSION IS WRONG NO MATTER WHO DOES IT. You can never achieve equality by saying "well his race, religion or sex was opressed for X number of years so he/she is entitled.
Irvin should be fired. NOW.
Last edited by dustylaker on November 27th at 7:44 PM.
Here is the problem I have RACISM does and will forever exist. Michael Irvin said something that he could have said in a room full of athletes and nothing would have been said because the comraderie they have. Michael still for whatever reason hasn't figured out that he is in "America's" living room and not the locker room. And the lineage lines are very crooked. So Romo may have black heritage. Does it make him a better player? NO! Michael Irvin is one of those guys that even if he is your friend you get nervous when he is addressing a group. Is it entertaining? Of course. Do you not think that ESPN a huge multimedia company doesn't realize that? They count on him saying things that keep the pot stirred and have us blogging about it.
We can all agree that Irvin is an #### yes ......for the stupid comments made ? But the problem is that ESPN needs charachters like him in the booth to provide the little tidbits like this that gets us all discussing a meaningless topic. If only he'd use time to make some useful observations whilst he's on the show we needn't be worried by his so called observations. But then every show like this needs a 'class clown' doesn't it ? Unfortunately it paints him out to be a complete and utter #### which is not how he really wants to be portrayed even though he's been paid to offer his comments on variety of subjects pertaining to the game of football.
Dusty - the blacks in africa have absolutely nothing to do with the blacks in America. We dont even consider ourselves the same race of people. our blood is diluted - which isnt a bad thing at all. the comparison is faulty.
as for reverse racism - it doesnt exist. Racism is universal and applies equally to everyone. honestly, it aint blacks complaining about #### that makes things hit the fan.i had a white english prof who used to drop the N-Bomb, ####, etc. but it was the white kids who reported him. us blacks thought he was just a crazy old man. when me and my buds get together - i have a mixed crowd - its the white guys dancing around the issues. we - as in my black friends - dont care what they say as long as they dont generalize. we go back and forth about our differences. also, i've known many white guys who have generalized views of blacks. but - at least in my running group - we dont spend nearly as much time devoted to talking about white. i once worked for a Deaf/Hard of Hearing translation service. i can tell you just from the 10,000 or so calls i answered over that long summer... the white callers, especially the older ones, spent 10x as much time discussing dirty mexicans and stupid blacks as the reverse. in fact, in 4 months, i never once transcribed a mexican conversation where they sat around discussion the state of the nation and how whites were destroying it. thats just food for thought. i could relate how my wife's (white) family treats me to this day. theyre from NY, theyre supposed to be more enlightened than the #### here in the South.
Last edited by demonicume on November 28th at 5:45 AM.
Michael Irvin is an #### and for some reason ESPN puts him on instead of anybody with the ability to comprehend and speak intelligently. ESPN Sucks Balls
i'm sorry bayoudog, if you cant be objecting STFU. this is a discussion not an argument. are we really comparing Mike Irvins stage presence to Jaws? or Steve young or coach ditka?
anyways. what mike said was wrong. he's stupid for thinking it would be taken as a joke simply because his homeboys think its funny. he wont be fired because the show writers get more clout for having a blacks on the cast than having quality spokesmen. as long as mike has an in with the players, as long as he's suave on-camera, he'll do whatever. i wish ya'll had the same freedom of speech that i do, but then again, it aint blacks getting up in arms when someone drops the N-Bomb.
when Kramer lost it, i could have cared less. but my white buddies could wait to hear how i felt about it. go figure. my wife is suitably offended though. i'm glad someone is.
Michael Irvin definitely needs to apologize. I believe that he should go as well. Plenty of examples out there of people who were fired after comments like that. Unfortunately Irvin is black and controversial, especially for the way he has stuck up for TO. ESPN will not get rid of him. He brings viewers to the show. SHOW ME THE MONEY, SAYS ESPN.
This is a non issue. Who gives a d$^%? "We don't have the same rights as a black man. He should be held accountable like Rush." There are far more important issues out there. I swear some people just look for a chance to retaliate. Dumb comment sure. But you guys are getting way to in depth. Ben was right, must be a slow day in the news.
Demon I have to take issue with what you said. The past 20 years I spent in the recording industry and I assure you as a black man myself, I TWICE heard the word "N" out of a white person and in both cases the person saying the word was asked to leave the building. I have heard non white and non blacks uses the same word numerous times and they were called on it. I heard young blacks use the word CONSTANTLY. And don't try it to pass it off as #### or ####. That is as it once was. It's not today. It's THE word.
At 60 years old I was one of those who marched and was arrested trying to get that word out of the mouths of people. People not only black but a variety of races died trying to get rid of that word and now young blacks use it not only regularly but in front of anyone and everyone. They use it on the street, in restaurents, EVERYWHERE. You reap what you sow young brother. Anyone hearing it long enough and loud enough will add it back into their voculabary intentionally or inadvertantly. And don't even bother trying to use the cop out "it doesn't mean the same thing when a black uses it.". IT MEANS EXACTLY THE SAME THING IN THE RAP CULTURE OF TODAY.
Last edited by dustylaker on November 28th at 2:44 PM.
In the world we live in everyone is racist, including me, i wish it werent, not that we show it or truly believe it, its just a small thought in our head. As for Irvin i see just as a joke a very stupid joke, but if he does this again espn should consider to fire him. But the truth is Black people as a group in sports are more.... theres more talant. I aint being racist im sayin the truth. And thats what Irvin was saying, the problem is people will take it as only blacks are good athletes. God made everbody the way they are.
I think you are correct NBAfan but what you don't do is deal directly as to WHY black kids tend to be more athletic than whites. For centuries now in America Black kids have not had cars as early on as white kids. They didn't have the money to go to the movies every week and so on. Their "playing" in the parking lots and on the sidewalks was basically all they had so they developed their bodies earlier, their coordination came earlier and their love of sports came earlier. This can be borne out by the fact that poor midwestern whites who had less money to "do things" outside of sports were generally more athletic across the board than the "sissies" of California and NYC in the past. You still following?
Having said all that, and I believe that to be true, nowdays I think it's changing back to more of an equal balance because instead of one group on the street playing sports while the other lives the easy life, they're all parked in front of a video game/computer. I think you'll see it start to all equal out.
I agree it will begin to even out, espn did a job on duke and having 5 white starters on thier team, i wish my race had some athletes... closest we got is vijay singh. I think will stick with slurpies.
Last edited by nbafan on November 28th at 3:30 PM.
The comments made by Irvin is worse than Rush's comments. Why? Because Irvin's has zero truth while Rush's argument has slightly more than zero truth to it. At the time Rush was correct when he said Donovan McNabb was overrated. Back then he was, but then that changed.
Therefore, Irvin was wrong and he should join Harold Reynolds in being an ESPN castoff.
You know what I wish? I wish political correctness would disappear and we could all just say what we wanted and if someone doesn't like it they can say whatever back that they wanted. People keep saying that Irvin won't be fired because he brings controversy and controversy means ratings (which is true) but how many people would be watching if Irvin was allowed to speak his mind regardless and a white co host was allowed to reply "that's the most ignorant garbage racist #### I ever heard" right back at him? I know I'd tune in next time and every time looking for some fireworks.LOL
Last edited by dustylaker on November 28th at 4:25 PM.
dustylaker ....... Isn't there room for common decency anymore and modicum of good behavior. It would appear that we can use words to purvey whatever we want to think without believing there'll be any consequences to these actions. Much as in the case with Irvin who probably still finds it somewhat amusing even if an apology were offered at a later date. Perhaps it's me but I somehow feel that we tend to lose respect for our fellow human beings all in the name of espousing something that's totally anathema to us all.
You know Ram in the 60's I believed like you. In the 70's I believed like you. In the 80's and the 90's. I now believe those "civilized, cultured, educated" (and they are) views are pie in the sky. All my lifetime more restrictions and laws have been put on speech and over the past 50 years it has not changed a single thing other than to give one more group the right to hate without another group responding. The goal was to stop all the hate and you can even take the whites out of the equation. Latino and Black hate each other, Latino and Asian hate each other. Black and Asian hate each other. It doesn't change anything. Change will only come with either total speech control taking place as under a Saddam type govt or we get back to FREE SPEECH and let learn to live with "sticks and stone will break my bones but words will never hurt me". We use words to alibi some VERY bad actions, so called "in response" nd "justified". Violence is NEVER justified by ANYONE because of what someones else "said."
Last edited by dustylaker on November 29th at 12:18 AM.
Just one thought I have on this, if Dan Patrick had said this to Michael Irvin instead of the the other way around, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton and all their cronies would be outside ESPN calling for his head.
Haven't heard a word from Jesse or anyone else about this. Coincidence??? Nope.
As I predicted in my first response here Monday, the issue has gone away everywhere else but here! I'll be surprised if it comes up again on ESPN or anywhere!
dustylaker ...... As a high school student living in London I found myself having to take a stance at the time against apartheid in South Africa. It was tantamount to seeing the British government speaking out both sides of its mouth but not doing anything about the situation until it was really pressed to. Many of my friends and fellow students at the time rallied outside the South African embassy in London on the weekends voicing our indifference to this former British colony and its treatment of our black brothers. Whites and blacks in London had found some solidarity on an issue that we could all agree on was a devilish act. Thankfully the whole world witnessed the release of Nelson Mandela from Robben Island and the dutiful change of a repressive regime in South Africa into a potent democratic society within the region. I know it still has some problems but I commend them on now taking the stance they've taken and seeing many of country's dreams having come to fruition. One man one one vote , freedom of expression and the right to co-exist alongside one's neighbor no matter what the color of their skin happens to be !
There you have it dustylaker ........I hope you can see where I'm coming from !
Come on everyone - I fail to understand why this topic has gained soo much attention. This is really not a big deal at all as it was blatently clear he was simply joking. As tastless as it has been viewed in the eyes of some, there is no reason (what so ever) to bring up such racial issues as a result of Irvin making a comment like that. I'm sure he is not feeling all that great about what came from his mouth, but I'm equally as assured he is not crying either. It is VERY easy to miss-interpret what one means when making comments and this is no different. He should deffinately be spoken to, maybe repremanded, but certainly not fired. Also, Nelson Mandella is a great man and should not at all be mentioned in the same breath with a ex-crack addict named Michael Irvin.
Anyway, we need to losen up a little bit people. I'm not saying forget about what was offending to some - Simply let the dead dog lay. Far too much time has already been spent on the topic.
It's gotten attention because Irvin has skated on this. How a guy can be blatantly racist and keep his job over it is ridiculous. That's why people are talking about it.
