Is Robert “Big Shot Rob” Horry a dirty player or just an extreme defender? Remember the hip shot on Nash, where suspension was ruled by the NBA on Amare and Diaw.
“West, who played with backside soreness in Game 5, fell to the floorboards after being picked from behind by Spurs forward Robert Horry, who was called for an offensive foul. Laying face down on the floor, West put his left arm behind him and rested it on his lower back before going to the locker room.” Associated Press
“I’m not real OK with it,” Scott told Yahoo! Sports. “But if I didn’t know Robert on a personal level, I’d say that was a dirty shot. Yeah, if I didn’t know him the way I know him, I’d say it was a cheap shot.” “I also think he understood what he was doing,” Scott said.
Look at it this way. If West had not been injured on that play, would we even be having this conversation? Of course not. Just like last season if the Suns players had stayed on the bench and the suspensions had not occured, no one would even remember the hit on Nash. It was no worse than dozens of other fouls during the season.
Horry's foul on West would have just been another foul, like the almost identical backscreen that Chandlier put on Tony Parker in the last game. It drew a foul, but I saw nothing on the blogs or the message boards about it the nest day. Why? Because Parker was not hurt.
Injury always makes a foul look worse.
But in the case of West, if he had not already been injured, the hit by Horry would not have been any big deal. West is big enough that it would not have even fazed him. The question is should a player go easy on an opposing player when they know they are injured. Most people would say no. If you are well enough to be out there, you are well enough to take normal hits and fouls.
I know I'm bringing up an old subject... but Stoudemire and Diaw walking too far away from the bench is worse than essentially slamming a guys head into the floor, pushing a guy in mid-flight, and various other atrocities that have gone on in these playoffs...
goTo,
The problem lies with this. If you watch it over in slow motion Horry didn't use body to set the screen he threw himself with arms crossed over his body into the lower back. Seems to me he targeted the spot. People can sit here and say hard fouls happen often but it doesn't make this one seem alright. Not the first time he has been malicious with his defense. forget last season check him out even further back than that.
What you can't see about this clip, unless you are a Hornets fan, is
that Darth Vader is just off camera, wearing a Spurs jersey and using
the force to compel David West to run backwards without looking, and
then jump into the air and stretch out his arms at the very instant he
was about to bump into Robert Horry, who was
standing well outside the no-charge circle with his feet set.
And why was Horry standing there in the first place with his wrists
crossed at his belt line? Just prior to tipoff, Horry called Miss Cleo,
his psychic, and was told to cut to the basket with 10:12 left in the game, and stand outside the key, because if he did, David West would leap backwards into the air and crash in to him and would have to leave the game. How else could Horry know how
to make this dirty play look like an innocent back pick?
And of course this play had a critical impact on the game. When West
went down, the Spurs were desperate because they were only leading by
21 points. But with West out of the way, the Spurs were able to give
back some of that lead and win by just 19. Wahahaha!
Oh good grief!
West was grimacing all game about his back. It just happened this was
the contact that set it off. West was in such distress that if it
wasn't this play, it would have been another.
Hornets fans can't HONESTLY think THIS is a cheap shot.
You know I don't wish to alienate my friend Gambit and wish him no setbacks due to stress, in his medical recovery but I have watched that video time after time after time.
Horry was set, West went up trying to intercept the ball, Horry bodied him to throw him off balance in his jump.
The offensive foul call was correct. It was a nudge as is done all the time and it was not a flagrant foul. Horry's arm was folded and he was set prior. Clean foul. Clean play.
My father broke his back years ago and we have learned not to even touch his back because anything can cause it to hurt him. West has a bad back. He got contact in just wrong spot. All there was to it.
Last edited by NiqueDodson on May 16th at 3:27 PM.
Spurcse
But in the case of West, if he had not already been injured, the hit by Horry would not have been any big deal. West is big enough that it would not have even fazed him. The question is should a player go easy on an opposing player when they know they are injured. Most people would say no. If you are well enough to be out there, you are well enough to take normal hits and fouls
Yeah, I agree that NBA basketball is a physical game and we love seeing it that way. The only problem lies on some guys in there that thrives to enforcing the limit of the rules on fouls and intentionally injuring opponents. When you see a team that employs dirty tactics like that then it cannot fun to watch anymore. As I see that matter on all the clips available and coverage of the game, Horry’s action is really on the bounds of a deliberate foul with the intention to hurt an opponent. Of all players does it always happen to Robert Horry, accidental foul?
Any way tnx for dropping by.
goTo
No Amare and Diaw’s case is not related to the subject at hand, I just happen to remember the aftermath of Horry’s hip checking on Nash. At any rate we both agree that Rob Horry did push DWest in mid-flight without a parachute to cling on.
Huh?! The only real intention Horry had was to set a screen!
What everyone SHOULD be talking about is Hornets' Coach Byron Scott.
David West was too injured to be playing, especially at a time in a game when the Hornets had virtually no chance of winning.
Byron Scott put his all star forward in harm's way on the outside chance that the Hornets could overcome a hopeless 21 point deficit, on the road, with 10 minutes left, with a disabled all star, who had 4 fouls, a technical foul and was shooting 28% (4/14), rather than concede game 6 and save his players for game 7 in New Orleans.
If Hornets fans want to gripe, they should be griping about their greedy coach, not about a legal pick.
I have to clarify that i am not a Hornet fans but diehard Lakers.
You're looking at Coach Scott as the wrongdoer here because he used DWest even with a bad back and all, then we can say the same against PhilJax too, because he is letting Kobe on the harm's way by letting him play with an injured back.
Is it then coincidental that Horry was also the one involved in the Nash incident? Rob is doing that action much too often. I do hope he will not maim anybody with this kind of legal pick as you call it and i also hope that this kind of defensive strategy is not the guiding principle in Popovich and his coaching staff.
You make a GREAT point, and I have already thought about that.
In my 20s, I was diagnosed with "degenerative disc disease." I live with chronic back pain every day. Eventually I'll have to have surgery and then will be much more limited in what I can do, but until then I try to enjoy what I love to do, including basketball and other sports and activities with my family.
But I have to really be careful and thoughtful, and gauge my pain constantly, lest I go on a hike with my boys and they end up having to carry me home.
So I've studied back pain, and it is my understanding that...
Kobe's back problems were spasms due to muscle strain.
David West's back problems were due to a BULGING DISC, and West has already missed 6 games during the regular season with this problem.
Do you see the difference?
Both coaches were taking a risk for sure, but there is a difference in both the odds and the stakes.
And it is not likely that Phil Jackson would have an injured and distressed Kobe Bryant in the game in the 4th quarter of a hopeless game.
Kobe usually spends the first part of the 4th quarter resting, and if the game looks to be out of reach, Phil would keep him there.
My point was that even if you believe the play deserved the foul, even if you believe it is a cheap shot, why is it any more of a cheap shot than the one Chandlier did to Parker in the previous game? And if Horry is going to be labeled as cheap, then shouldn't Chandlier get the same label? After all, I have seen complaints of Chandler's tactics before.
And what about Paul? I know of at least three times now that he has been guilty of punching players in the nuts. Once in college for which he received a suspension. And this year, he punched Bowen in the nuts, and Parker just the other night.
And what about West himself? All the fouls he has received have not been touch fouls. Some of them have been pretty close to the line. And clapping his face in Fabricio's face the other night, what was that all about? And patting Dirk on the face. How disrespectful and cowardly was that knowing that if Dirk retaliated, he would draw a foul. West tries to entice other players into things like that. That is cheap.
It seems it is easy to label other teams' players as dirty, but a little harder when it is your own team.
Spursce,
I truely respect you and try to understand every point you are trying to make. The only thing I can never make any sense of about you is you always look for reasons to excuse what was done. Also you always say what about when this player did this and that. So let me ask you if you and another driver both run a red-light and you are the only one who gets stopped by the police are you going to say to him "Hey that other guy ran it to why you didn't stop him?"
No, I would not. But I would be angry if everyone acted like I was the only one who ever ran a red light and made excuses for their friends who did it too. I never said Horry should not have gotten a foul. I said it was questioned by some people.
My point is that people are acting like he is some horrible lowlife person for a play that is not that infrequent. but ignore the same behavior from their own players. I find that a little hypocritical. I just think that is unfair. I do not believe his "sin" was so bad he should be labeled a cheap player like that is all he has ever done and that the rest of his career should just be wiped out as though it never happened.
And by the way, how do you feel about the Chandlier hit on Parker? You and most of the Hornets fans just ignore that question. I have never had an answer.
I guess one reason it seems I am always defending someone is because I am not usually a person who goes on the attack. If you have read any of my blogs, I have never written one that attacks.
Perhaps I should start writing blogs about some of the dirty tricks I have seen some of the Hornets players pull. I should have written a blog on West patting Dirk on the face or clapping his hands in Fabricio's face.Obviously trying to entice them into retaliating. And the punching the Spurs players in the nuts by Paul. Then other people can go on the defensive.
But that is not my style. I usually just respond to other people's blogs. Sorry if I offend you.
I like Bobby. He's an amazing guy. I saw his profile on a FREE & HOT celebrity dating site called ' R i c h M a t c h M a k in g . co m'. But I don't know if it is him. You may go there and check if it is just a rumor
You said: "I find that a little hypocritical. I just think that is unfair. I do not believe his "sin" was so bad he should be labeled a cheap player like that is all he has ever done and that the rest of his career should just be wiped out as though it never happened."
Horry should have thought of the consequences prior to doing such a dastardly feat. The trouble with Horry is that at his late age, he still would like to be relevant by doing something devious to the detriment of other people and teams entailed in that play.
You said: "And by the way, how do you feel about the Chandlier hit on Parker? You and most of the Hornets fans just ignore that question. I have never had an answer."
Every act which is not in agreement with best norm a player ought to be doing in court should be condemned. I was unable to watch that one, but if it is indeed visible to one’s eye that it was his objective to harm Parker, Chandler should have been censured too.
I am not in any manner saying that this kind of activity lies solely on the Spurs, unfortunately two of the most notorious brow beater in the NBA namely Bowen and Horry are always getting themselves involved in this kind of situations and they were with San Antonio. Popovich is a topnotch coach and he at all times amaze me with his good plays and suffocating defense, but he shouldn’t tolerate his players to employ this kind wrongdoing.
Spursce said: "Perhaps I should start writing blogs about some of the dirty tricks I have seen some of the Hornets players pull. I should have written a blog on West patting Dirk on the face or clapping his hands in Fabricio's face.Obviously trying to entice them into retaliating. And the punching the Spurs players in the nuts by Paul. Then other people can go on the defensive."
You should do that, to inform the public with respect to the Hornets dirty tricks or on any other team that were utilizing those less than classy ploys. We all know that blogs are once expression of their thought; moreover, it is a component of our freedom of expression and the right to information.
I have written post regarding the tasteless flopping of CP3 more than what Vlade Divac or Manu is doing.
You said: "But that is not my style. I usually just respond to other people's blogs. Sorry if I offend you."
May I correct you that my post is not an attack to Horry’s person or to the Spurs (Spurs is my 2nd team as Duncan is my second favorite player) as a team; I am just getting functional information on what some people feel on that episode. No i am okay, i know you mean no offense.
Many tnx for the post and to those posters like you. I have collated useful informative points on this.
nwhatdheck, My response was not aimed at you, it was in response to gambibox who said I was always looking for excuse for what was done. My point was simply that one reason it may appear that way is because my posts are usually a response to attacks
on the Spurs. Therefore it appears I am always on the defensive.
And "dastardly feat?" LOL Isn't that a bit melodramatic? And you answered the Chandlier/Parker question the same way everyone does. "Well IF he was trying to hurt Parker, it should be condemned." But no opinion on what actually happened. The only things I have seen on it were the ones who claimed it was perfectly legal play that should have not been called for a foul. Sounds pretty familiar doesn't it. Pretty much just like Horry's.
So how are we to tell if someone is trying to hurt someone? We can't read their minds although a lot of us like to think we can. We usually judge on the results. Parker was not hurt, so no harm done, West was hurt, so Horry's act was dastardly. But again that is all in the eye of the beholder. Many people have said it was nothing more than a normal basketball play and that if West had not already been injured, it would have not even noticed. Possibly not even drawn a foul. Others act like Horry mugged him with a sledgehammer.
And yet, in viewing the two, Chanlier's was just as bad, if not worse, because he extended his arms to hit Parker.
And yes, I do find it hypocritical for people to condemn Horry and Bowen for that matter for the kinds of things that they will excuse in the players on their own team.
nwatdheck, I have issue with one comment you made about Bowen and Horry ALWAYS getting themselves involved in this kind of situation.
I will grant you that Bowen is frequently involved in plays that are considered questionable.
But Horry? Before last season, when he knocked Nash into the scorers table, just what situation has he been involved it? Until then, Horry was never considered even marginally a dirty player.
So just what other dastardly deeds did he do? Certainly not since he has been with the Spurs.
Spurcse: LOLs… Is it a bit theatrical? Sorry buddy, as I have told you b4 in my post I was not able to watch the Chandler/Parker episode and I cannot place any rational observation on it. I recognize the way you endure reading unfavorable commentary on Spurs players and I am bit worrying that you might catch high blood pressure over it or maybe an heart attack. I don’t want anything to happen to you, so I might just as well stop this. Anyway I have what I want to achieve in my post.
Yeah, I know of your affection to team San Antonio and you can be affected by that. I myself revere the whole lot San Antonio has done so far over the course of the last decade and they're one of my preferred teams because of the magnitude of Duncan’s feat. However, what Horry did the other night was a contemptible attempt to hurt a fellow basketball player, much in sequence of what he carried out against Steve Nash last year. I just can’t figure out why Big Shot Rob has to go to this ill-advised type of cheap play. Everybody knew that David West was hurting and doing that intentionally to aggravate his situation is considered out of class and Horry should be aware of this. There was really no enormous basis to blindside David West in the back, whether you like him or not.
You said: So just what other dastardly deeds did he do? Certainly not since he has been with the Spurs.
Horry admittedly is one of the unparalleled clutch shooters and playoff performers in history of the NBA, sorry to say, IMHO, he denigrates his place in NBA history by his unsolicited antics. The match was au fait, there was no genuine challenge for a comeback and such an effort was superfluous on various reasons. It only supplies ammunition for those conspiracy thinkers who feel the Spurs are all about trickery, whining to the refs and deliberate fouls as an alternative to team chemistry, team concept and the distinctive brilliance of Duncan, Parker and Manu. What Robert Horry did was not a "veteran" play, it was unfair play and for no reason whatsoever. This being said, let us now put to rest this debate… please?
I am a die hard Lakers fan. I am Filipino basketball enthusiast and love the game so much.
I am 28 years old male, studied and finish architecture at Mapua University here in the Philippines and presently practising my profession.
Go Lakers!!!!
