NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman has had enough of the Philadelphia Flyers "Broad Street Bullies Redux".
Bettman warned Flyers GM Paul Holmgren that the next on-ice incident involving
a Flyers player would result in hefty fines for the organization.
League disciplinarian Colin Campbell handed down a three-game suspension to Flyers goon Riley Cote for his head shot elbowing of Dallas Stars defenseman Matt Niskanen during Saturday's Flyers-Stars game.
Holmgren acknowledged that as of now his club is "under watch", and for good reason. This was the fifth incident involving a Flyers player dating back to late September.
As per TSN:
So far this season, the Flyers have had five players suspended for on-ice acts of violence: Steve Downie got 20 games for a head shot on Ottawa's Dean McAmmond; Jesse Boulerice got 25 games for a crosscheck to the head of Vancouver Ryan Kesler; Randy Jones got two games for a hit from behind on Boston's Patrice Bergeron; Scott Hartnell got two games for hitting Boston's Andrew Alberts' head into the boards when the player was on his knees and defenceless;
and now Cote's high head-shot on Niskanen netted a three game
suspension.
The latest incident was obviously the last straw for Bettman, and is something I and others have been suggesting for some time.
While the Jones incident was in my opinion an accident, the rest were deliberate attempts to injure. That many incidents over such a short period of time couldn't be ignored and had to be addressed by the league.
What is the NHL willing to do? Will they go as far as the NFL did and take away draft picks? I think the coach could use a suspension, but whatelse would hurt Philly?
Wouldn't is be great if they would dock the team points like they do in Nascar for rule violations. Could you see Philly getting docked 10 points and then missing the playoffs by two points? Wouldn't that be great? It is not going to happen, but that would send a better message, most owners (and I understand Snider is not one of them) covets playoff revnue that home games bring, to lose that could send the right message. I know it won't happen but wanted to suggest it anyway
The team must pay the consequences if a player is suspended. They should not be allowed to replace a suspended player, rather they should have to shorten their roster. If I'm not mistaken, the Flyers cut one of their suspended players. The NHL shouldn't allow them to replace that player until his suspension is over. And not just the Flyers, any team leaguewide that has suspended players.
mdd15: I was thinking the same thing, although I was thinking more along the lines of docking them one victory's worth of points for each infraction after the third. I also think the Jones hit was an error of judgement, but Hartnell's clearly wasn't. He knew what he was doing, as did Boulerice and Downie. That's three, they should have had the major warning after the Bruins game.
It'd be nice to see the team punished when a group of players on a team take to breaking the rules. Some folks may want to treat it as five separate occasions, but I'm having difficulty seeing past the orange jerseys these days. It's getting tiresome.
Spector, do you think teams will ever lose standings points during a season for this kind of thing? Is it something the governors might have on their plate for spring break?
Come on now fellas, docking a team points because a player gets suspended or lays a dirty hit? That's not reasonable nor practical. What happens in the case of Randy Jones where it was clearly not an intent to injure but he did and that's why he got games.....you'd dock the flyers points because of an accident? Like I said, not reasonable, nor practical. Not to mention you'd be taking away a team's effort to get those 2 points and easily taking them away for a bogus cheap shot or a pure accident. I just can't comprehend how that would ever happen or the basic property of fairness and competitive-ness.
Simply fine the player while he's suspended and fine the team. The GM has less money to play with and he's pissed! He then sends down the message and the whole team hears it clearly. Simple as that.
Playing a man short is somewhat an alternative method but the team is "handicapped" and in all fairness, why should one team have the upper edge like that.
more blathering from bettman...
four (or five, depending on your pov of the jones hit) suspended dirty hits should be more than enough to start punishing the team...
There ought to have been a hefty fine imposed after the Hartnell hit... but one dangerous hit later, all they get is a warning...
is there some way we can get bettman on the receiving end of one of these hits? Not to get seriously hurt, but just enough for him to leave hockey and never come back?
Thats right....any questionable hits from now on should result in a fine, suspension and possibly being baned from hockey! If its a flyers player, then the whole team has to play the rest of the season on shoes!!! BETTER YET, NO BODY CONTACT!!!!!!!!!!!
Pretty soon they're going to be handing out suspensions for looking at people the wrong way
Really if you're a coach or a GM you're responsible for how your team plays to an extent and you should have them trained well enough to not do that kind of ####. If you think that they're going to go overboard on the physical play then you shouldn't play them.
If one of your players gets suspended then you should be forced to play a man short for however long the suspension is.
Dooberz21 has the right idea: suspended players should not be replaced on or cut from the roster. Teams should have to play with less guys. It never ceases to amaze me that a crosscheck to the head gets 20 games, while the far more dangerous cheap shots on Bergeron and Alberts got 2 games only.
As a Flyers fan, I'm not going to try to defend here...Boulerice is an ####, Cote's latest was purely stupid and he gets what he deserved, and bad judgement can be used to describe Hartnell. The Downie suspension, while actionable in my opinion, 20-games was an absolute joke. And the Jones hit was a hit that occurs a half dozen times in every game only this time it resulted in an extremely unfortunate injury...want to make a point to the players, fine. The 2-gamer was fair.
But now we're talking about surrendering points in the standings and making the organization pay hefty fines...C'mon people, use some common sense when analyzing these incidents. I understand issuing warnings and getting the "teams" to address the concerns. But lets cool off the "dirty" and "cheap shot" BS...I'd recommend against this tide of over-reaction as a result of these incidents and the rush to label every hit as "another" example of dirty play. Pretty soon every roughing call against the Flyers is going to be reviewed by the league and we'll get to read about it the next morning on FoxSports.com...
If it's going to make everyone feel better if Mr. Stevens and Mr. Holmgren stand in the corner for a few hours, so be it. Can we get back to playing (and covering) hockey now?
1) Is there any precedent with this? Has the NHL ever fined a GM/coach/team for an aggregate number of incidents?
2) Can anyone out there point to one iota of evidence that these 5 incidents are linked back to Stevens/Holmgren/Snyder, etc?
3) The NFL comparison is ludicrous. In that case there was clear cut evidence of cheating. here you have a series of separate incidents from different individuals. Drawing conclusions about a conspiracy is easy to make, but difficult to prove.
4) The players who commit the fouls should be severely punished. Period! Else change the rules, don't make up new ones as we go along. BTW we at Fauxrumors are NOT Flyer fans!
I agree that penalizing the organization is kind of silly - perhaps Campbell should start handing out suspensions that actually deter players from these kinds of hits instead.
Also the comments about the Jones hit clearly being an accident. C'mon, I'm on the other side of the coin, but you can't say definitively one way or the other that there was no intent to injure. The guy put his arms directly into the numbers of the back of an opposing player and pushed him head first into the boards. Is it possible it was an accident? Sure. Is it obvious? Give me a break.
Sean: Reread my statement. The Jones hit was not malicious and really didn't warrant suspension. I think the front office got it wrong. But, I think Bettman should have issued his warning after the Hartnell hit. It's fairly obvious when hits are and are not intentional. So, in the case of the Jones hit, he's suspended because of injury (which sucks if you ask me), and we move on with no further punishment.
Cote'####, however, was vicious and unacceptable, particularly in the late part of the game. Since the players and staff have failed to keep proper etiquette on the ice, why not punish the entire organization? We're talking about three malicious hits during the season and one in preseason. You can try to tell me it's not the organization's fault, but I won't apologize for laughing.
If they fined the team and had it count against the cap, that might be a worthy repercussion. Punishing the team for one arbitrary act doesn't make sense, but since they've now committed four and were the victim of circumstance on a fifth, maybe it's time to start penalizing them by removing a roster position for a stretch of games.
"Can anyone out there point to one iota of evidence that these 5 incidents are linked back to Stevens/Holmgren/Snyder, etc?"
Of course they're linked back to those people; all the players play on the same team.
It's one thing for 4 different players around the league to be involved in hits from behind or attempt to injure (not counting the Jones' hit). It's another for them all to be from the same team.
If a Walmart employee decided to insult a customer, you can call it a bad day. If it happens 4-5 times by different employees, there's obviously a problem in the system. A manager is responsible for the actions of the employees, and the owner is responsible for the actions of the managers. This is the way in business, why should the NHL be any different?
"The players who commit the fouls should be severely punished. Period!"
There's been FOUR different deliberate attempts to injure from FOUR different people. Punishing the player severely HAS NOT helped. They've been given out over 50 games in suspensions and it's STILL happening.
The solution of punishing the player and the player only has not proven successful. Something else has to be done or said.
I've read your comments and you asked me to re-read them and I did.....surprise surprise...they are exactly the same as the first time i've read them right from the part where you agree with "moonagedaydream15" to the part where you think docking a team points because of recurring events is a good idea. And I appologize for laughing also, but that idea is.....to put it lightly, retarded! I'm not saying you're retarded, the idea of docking a team points because of malicious hit is retarded. Again I step back to Jones and that the only reason why he got suspended was because of the injury...that being said, you'd dock the team the 2 points they hauled out of that game because of an accident? Or better yet, what if the team didn't win (the team who made the malicious hit)...you'd dock them 2 pts from a complete different game? Sorry, the idea is filled with sillyness. Say what you like about Hartnell'####, I think the league handled it spot on and the statement Campbell had clearly showed me that he actually understood what happened. Everybody seems to hate the flyers because its re-curring and that's half the reason why they are under so much heat. I'm sure there are other hits in the league that are much more worse its just that nobody gets hurt or they aren't flyer players who lay them out.
I like the idea of further penalizing a team or organization when malicious hits oocur, but the reality is, how do you define the hits? And, just as the examples above, how do yo penalize for the "cheap shots" from the "accidental" hits? I am not sure you could enforce a judgement call.
I wonder if the league and the players realize that these hits are totally magnified by the media and those who do not like or understand hockey? Its further hurts the image o####reat game.
Soapbox time: As long as goons like Bertuzzi can still play, the idioits like Boulerice and Downie will still find work in the NHL. I say suspend them forever when they do what those three did. There are plenty of guys willing to play by the rules and looking for a chance at the NHL. Let's see the NHL get tough. It claims its a tough game, lets see them send some real "tough love" and rid themselves of these numbskulls.
I'm re-posting some comments, because they still apply:
Why is no one mentioning that the Flyers organization DID take action with Boulerice by releasing him, specifically because of what he did to Kessler?
We've got players that have head shots taken with 3 seconds left in a game that the Flyers won. Downie had a from behind cheap shot before the McAmmond hit, which wasn't called. That penalty gets called and maybe McAmmond doesn't get hurt. That doesn't excuse what Downie did, he never should have left his feet or attempted to hit him in the head.
Why is it that Coburn and Briere can get sticks to the head, but not get any calls?
How is it that Ohlund can take a two handed "baseball bat" swing and break someone's leg and only get 4 games? Try convincing me he didn't mean it. Please.
The NHL is back to its inconsistant ways again, plain and simple. You want to stop shots to the head? Call ALL of them, not just the ones where players get hurt. You want players to not get hurt? Maybe players should spend some time on how not to put themselves in dangerous situations.
The NHL has alot of explaining to do with their suspension "system", because it sure doesn't seem to be applied evenly.
More things that no one is talking about with the Flyers...comments from John Stevens and Paul Holmgren:
"We were too easy to play against last year," Stevens said. "We want to be competitive and gritty, but certainly have respect for the game and the rules of the game. That incident has no place in the game." - referring the Jessie Boulerice
"I met with [Boulerice] right after the game," said Flyers coach John Stevens. "There is nothing good that comes out of an incident like that. There is no place in the game for that. You have to respect the rules of the game."
"It is a fair penalty," Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren said of yesterday's decision. "I expected 25 or worse. Hopefully, we don't have to visit Mr. Campbell again this year. In my opinion, and I've talked to Jesse about this as well, it was a careless act on his part."
Bettman and deputy commissioner Bill Daly spoke to Holmgren in separate calls after Cote's hearing. Asked whether the players will be informed now that the league has put the organization on notice, Holmgren said, "It has been addressed and will continue to addressed. We want to play hard but play within the rules. It has to stop."
"What do you want a player like that to do? You've got to make a decision in a very quick amount of time. Hopefully, a situation like that doesn't arise again. We want our players to play hard and finish their checks, but we want them to be more careful in situations like that." - Paul Holmgren in reference to Scott Hartnell's suspension.
So people that are making it sound like the Flyers are tell
"Soapbox time: As long as goons like Bertuzzi can still play, the idioits like Boulerice and Downie will still find work in the NHL."
There's a huge difference between Bertuzzi and Boulerice that you're not taking into account though. Bertuzzi, healthy, can score and has demonstrated all-star offensive ability. Boulerice has never had a year in the AHL or NHL with double digit goals or assists, and has never been anything but a 3-4 minute a game player sent out to fight and hurt people.
Comparing Bertuzzi (1 intent to injure blindside punch in almost 1000 NHL/OHL games, along with 343 goals and 484 assists) to Boulerice (2 blatant intents both involving his stick in 514 games, along with 55 goals and 68 assists, and 1591pm) is ridiculous.
Brettuzzi, obviously, we are not going to agree, but come on now. Kessler is playing and contributing to his team. Steve Moore is no able to lace them up. Bertuzzi gets to come back and play for the Dead Wings in the playoffs last eyar, and gets a chance with the defending Stanley Cup champ Ducks this year. I guess because he scored goals and assists he can come back and play, but Boulerice (a nobody) can't? They both don't belong in hockey.
Let's call a #### a #### in that two individuals (Boulerice and Bertuzzi - from what you guys are talking about) made some classless hits. The Bertuzzi story has been going around and around and around since it happened. And to say the obvious, what he did was vicious and disturbing, and what Boulerice did was the same, but for no reason should anybody separate the two in that one incident was lighter than the other. Bertuzzi is seen as a contributor, a goal scorer, a vertern leader but that doesn't take away what he done. Boulerice is young, and quite frankly an enforcer and for someone to say that Boulerice doesn't belong while Bertuzzi is home free is a huge oversight and a mistake.
"I also think the Jones hit was an error of judgement, but Hartnell's clearly wasn't. "
Strange how my agreeing with you that the Jones hit was an accident, whereas the others clearly weren't makes my point invalid. Yours must be too by that logic. It looks to me like you chose to ignore parts of what I said. Guess I'll repeat myself.
For the first three events (Downie, Boulerice and Hartnell), individuals are punished. Beyond that event (which is EXPLICITLY EXCLUDING Jones' hit because it looked unintentional), the team is docked 2 standing points for each recurrence. That seems perfectly fair to me when it's clear the team is gooning it up on the ice and individual punishments aren't sending the message.
21 players ... 4 have committed suspension-worthy penalties. Why, that's nearly 20% of the team! Hey, the league should probably look into why a fifth of a team's committed suspension-worthy actions, and at least warn the management "Hey, cut the #### or pay the price."
Letting them off with a two-game suspension drops their offenses down to accident-level and puts them on par with Jones' hit. You'd have to be crazy to put the three hits in question on the same level. Are you that crazy?
When a large percent of the team is doing the same thing, it becomes a team-wide problem. Punish the team.
chaas... that should read 5 players, nearly 25% of the team!...
The problem clearly needs addressing at the team/management level. I'm not sure what the answer is, but there are a few good ideas here.
For one thing, I've always felt that suspended player should not be allowed back on the ice before the return of the player he has injured.
The Flyers have stated that they played a little too soft last season and want to become a more physical, gritty team. More power to them, until it is carried too far. These WWF On Ice antics are ruining the integrity of the game. It's unprecedented that a team would have so many players suspended A) This early in a season and B) this close together.
I think a good starting point is to not allow a team to call up a roster replacement after X many incidents in a season. The repercussions should be felt team-wide on a team-wide problem.
Oh NO!!!!!!!!!! Philly is giving out head shots now lets do something about it??? Can you say Eric Lindros or Jeremy Roenick or Keith Prima all top centers for the Flyers also can you say Simon Gagne active top center in the league? The centers all ended their NHL careers with head shots and Gagne may be in the same boat with them.. And lets see - WOW how about that - not one player that hit them was given a suspention or the team given any fines but now that Philly does it, lets nail them to the wall. Don't stop hittin' them Philly just because the league wants to play no hit hockey ..GOOD JOB BATeMAN, keep up the good job........
I'm Lyle Richardson, also known as Spector, Foxsports.com 's "Prince of Pucks".,which is based on the fact I live in Prince Edward Island, Canada and I couldn't think of a better byline. I've been an NHL hockey commentator since 1998 on my website, Spector's Hockey, and I'm a contributing writer for Foxsports.com , The Hockey News and Eishockey News. I'm also a regular on The Faceoff Hockey Show and a frequent guest on "The Late Crew" on The Team 1200 Ottawa.
