Another break day and so an opportunity to answer some questions.
Danielgregg – Something I've noticed about this tournament, don't recall if it's something unique or not: there've been so many records broken. Croatia broke some kind of record when they beat Germany, Turkey broke their record against the Czechs, the Dutch beat their 30-year record against Italy, and Italy beat their 30-year record against France, and now Spain banished their longstanding record against not only Italy, but their June 22 jinx.
You probably don't put too much store in these records. I just think it's been interesting to see so many games one after another with pundits pointing out these records before almost every game, and then they go and promptly break them--so consistently.
Bobby – There have been a good number of these instances. I think it would need a statistician to provide more intelligent comment. But you also have to consider that international match ups don’t happen every year or sometimes even every second year and so extended records of 20 or 30 years may only be less than a dozen games. Something that happens in domestic league leagues
LHJS - I hope one day the America's can combine to form a great tournament like EURO's. 8 groups, 5 or 6 teams per group, winner and second place team gets an invite. Every country between Chile and Canada would have a chance. I think it would be great fun for all soccer fans. A nightmare for police but still as we see on TV it could be great.
Bobby – This is something that comes up on a pretty regular basis. I can’t see either Federation amalgamating for the purposes of World Cup qualifying but maybe there is just a small chance that they could get together for a regional championship.
Here is a précis of an article I wrote for “WSC – When Saturday Comes” back in April 2002 just after the Gold Cup of that year.
“……The more astute readers will have noticed that South Korea and Ecuador are not Central American, North American or Caribbean counties. Since it’s inception in 1991 the Gold Cup has invited guest teams to compete, not something that lends credibility to the competition. It’s simple: when you invite outside teams to enter a regional championship it’s no longer a regional championship.
Can anyone imagine the European Championship inviting Brazil, Argentina and Cameroon to fly in for a game or two? In the past we’ve seen Peru, Colombia and Brazil turn up along with South Korea and Ecuador. To date no guest has won the Cup but two have reached the Final.
This time around only Mexico drew well in the early stages and after they lost in the quarter final to South Korea, average attendance dropped dramatically. Despite the USA reaching the final where they beat Costa Rica 2-0, the last four games in the competition attracted less than 22,000 fans. Cup organizers were quick to point out that the Cup was up against the National Hockey League all-star game and the Superbowl weekend. It begs the question - why would you schedule the Gold Cup against these events in the first place?
The problems facing the Gold Cup are strikingly similar to those facing CONMEBOL and the Copa America. Copa America with the ten member countries of CONMEBOL has to invite two guest countries in order to get to a workable number. Honduras, Mexico, Japan, the USA and Costa Rica have all taken part in the Copa in recent years. There is, however, a solution – the Pan American Cup.
Never heard of it you say? That’s because it’s time to drop both the Copa America and the Gold Cup and start a new sixteen team tournament to be held once every four years with no guest teams.
To ease fixture congestion the tournament could be scheduled just before or just after the European Championship. A Pan American Cup makes sense for everyone, including the long suffering fans.
From a CONCACAF prospective it gives their member countries the badly needed challenge of better opponents. The participation of Brazil and Argentina would increase television revenue in the US and generate greater media exposure throughout North America.
With the imminent demise of the ill fated and vastly unpopular Confederations Cup the need to identify regional champions no longer exists. If the Pan American Cup could live up to half of its potential, the qualifying competitions would generate interest.
By holding the tournament two years after the World Cup, qualification standings in each confederation could form the basis of awarding automatic spots in the Pan American Cup, perhaps the top five finishers in each. As tradition dictates, the previous winner would get a bye along with the host country.
With four spots remaining, three could come from a Central and South American qualifying competition while the remaining spot would be from a North America and Caribbean tournament.
Is there hope that CONMEBOL and CONCACAF would give up some of their power and merge the two troubled competitions? From a CONCACAF prospective they run a competition of no value, so they have little to lose by making a move. CONMEBOL’s view is likely to be different given the Copa America is the oldest international tournament in the world.
However, FIFA has already told the South Americans that an eighteen game World Cup qualifying competition can’t continue if the Copa America is held every two years. The South American qualifying group generates tremendous interest and a great deal of money.
It’s not something the CONMEBOL countries want to lose so the status quo may not be an option. The alternatives are changing the Copa America to a four year format or make a bold move and go for a Pan American Cup.”
Shmish - What's your take on the criticisms that are being leveled on coaches such as MVB and Donadoni? It's predictable that Aragones or Loew will also be condemned by media and bloggers. I think all of these men seem to have done a good job, but I'm not a soccer analyst.
Whether a team is outplayed or outcoached, do we always have to point fingers at the coaches? Surely as Bobby suggests, we should pay attention and offer praise to the winners, when praise is due. One man's or team's success doesn't necessarily equate to another's failure.
Bobby – When a team loses the coach more times than not becomes a lightning rod for criticism. At club level there is almost always a game coming within a week or so and the coach and team have an escape route. That’s rarely the case at international level with friendlies and competition spread out.
Coaches know the “rules” when they sign on as unfair as they may be. But each defeat produces knee-jerk reactions from the fans and the media and the pressure builds on the national associations for a change to be made. Without having lived through it I doubt many of us can truly understand the constant pressure that coaches all operate under.
So much of it comes down to managing expectations going in, unfortunately as fans most of us have expectations that are unrealistic. I’m waiting for the day when a fan admits he would have picked a different team than the one the coach did and because the team won its obvious the coach knows what he’s doing and has not lost the plot!
Terry 63 - Hey Bobby, we're missing the Tartan Army at these major tourneys. Start checking the census rolls to see if there are any Scots with Brazilian grandmothers. Of course...I meant to say Brazilians with *Scottish* grandmas! But either way couldn't hurt.
Bobby – At least Scotland has shown some improvement over the last couple years. Under Berti Vogts a team made up of Brazilian grandmothers might have been a better option. That’s what you meant wasn’t it?
ZUCO2 - I was watching the FSR yesterday and I heard Derek say that there was 9 minutes of added time in a qualifying game in Asia. Shouldn't FIFA have a rule that allows referees to give a certain amount of stoppage time? A sort of limit that shouldn't be broken?
Bobby – So what you do in the situation where there was a serious injury and possibly even a couple of serious injuries? Or the game is delayed because of a streaker? It is up to the referee to judge how much stoppage time should be played I don’t see any benefit by capping it – and in fact I think the opposite is true, it would lead to more abuse.
Exponents - Bobby, off topic, but let's say the USMNT needed a new coach (I think you'll agree that they do)...who should they try to get? Of course this begs the question of who would actually want to coach the USMNT.
Bobby – No, I actually don’t agree. To date Bradley has won the only competition the United States has entered since he became coach (Gold Cup) so why would you be looking to replace him?
Rowdies33 - I haven't seen much heat on Van Basten for his tactics during the game. RVP played on the right flank where he has played before in this tourney, but he was always looking for the cutback and Heitinga wasn't getting forward so there was no width on the right and then by not bringing Robben in on the left there was no presence going forward on the left to stretch the field.
Given the difficulties of set pieces for the Russian defense, wouldn't crosses from wide positions have likely given them problems? Of course, the Russians dominated the play and perhaps nothing changes, but it seemed like the Dutch offense was basically using 1/2-3/4 of the width of the field making the Russians defensive pressure much easier to employ. Thoughts?
Bobby – It might be a bit pointless turning up the heat up on van Baston given that we all knew he was finished with the Netherlands after this tournament. You do make valid points however.
But the problems that the Russians were experiencing from set pieces were coming from in swinging free kicks on the left. Robbin would be delivering more conventional out swinging crosses with his left foot so I’m not sure the two would necessarily be connected. I was surprised that the Dutch did not try and force the Russian full backs to defend more and instead allowed them to attack almost at will.
I think the brilliance of Hiddink’s strategy was to counter the counterattack by pinning the Dutch so deep and not giving them time on the ball that they are unable to use the counterattack tactic that had been so lethal in the group stage.
LHJS - I almost forgot, Bobby did I catch Carlos?
Bobby –Carlos picked up nine points in the quarterfinal round and has 37 points. However, he only has one team left and that is Spain. He has Spain down as beaten finalists.
RINGO - Do those who predicted the third place game lose points?
Bobby – No, they just have to suffer the public embarrassment of adding games that don’t exist.
Comment of the Day
“I bumped into Howard Webb, the English referee, at Zurich Airport last Friday. He was on his way back to Manchester, having not been retained for the knockout stages of Euro 2008, after his controversial decision in the final minutes of the match between Austria and Poland. Webb was no different to a lot of other Englishmen at leading tournaments, really, in that he was eliminated by penalties.” - Martin Samuel in The Times.
Stat of the Day 1: Number of the past 52 goals in the tournament to have come from a defender — Christian Panucci - From Bill Edgar of The Times.
This will make it six consecutive appearances for Netherlands at the European Championship finals. They won the tournament twenty years ago in Germany, made it to another four semi-finals (76, 92, 00, and 04) and lost at the quarter final stage in 1996.
How they qualified The Dutch relied on their wonderful home record in Euro qualifying that has seen them go unbeaten since losing to Luxembourg in 1963. Six wins and a draw in Group G extended the Dutch streak to 41 games without a loss over the last forty-five years.
Both losses in Group G came away from home with the set back against Belarus coming after qualification had been guaranteed. The Netherlands finished three points behind Romania (the other loss) and one ahead of Bulgaria. Robin van Persie scored four times for the Dutch.
The Coach Regarded by many as the greatest centre forward of all time Marco van Basten made sure that there was long pause between his injury enforced retirement and his return to the game as a coach.
The appointment as the national team coach after Euro 2004 was his first senior position after working with youth players at Ajax. After the tournament in Switzerland and Austria, van Basten will take over the coaching reins at Ajax and will be replaced by veteran Dutch coach Bert van Marwijk.
Key Players The conclusion of the tournament will see the Netherland’s most capped player goalkeeper Edwin van der Sar retire from the international arena. Captain of the Dutch team van der Sar is coming off of a European-Premiership double and his performances in qualifying kept the Ditch goals against to only five in twelve games.
Rafael van der Vaart is the pulse of Hamburg of the Bundesliga and if given the chance by van Basten his midfield promptings and an eye for a long range shot could prove valuable to the Netherlands.
With the likes of Robin van Persie, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Klaas-Jan Huntelaar and Jan Vennegoor of Hesselink you would think goals would flow freely but a return of only fifteen goals in twelve qualifying games tells a different story.
Great Euro Memory With losses to the home nations at both the 1974 and 1978 World Cups fresh in the memory the Dutch finally won a major championship when they beat the Soviet Union 2-0 in the European Championship Final of 1988. No one who saw Marco van Basten’s goal will ever forget it – a classic.
Synopsis Many fans second favourite country in big tournaments based on the quality of the football they consistently deliver… up until the last couple of years that is. However, the Netherlands only have the 1988 European Championship to show for all their efforts hence the reason for Marco van Basten’s more pragmatic approach over the last few seasons.
The back four looks to be little more than competent while the midfield may turn out to be light weight. One of the big name forwards (that is not necessarily a reference to Jan Vennegoor of Hesselink) has to be provided with quality service and hit a hot streak of form if the Dutch hope make it out of this GROUP OF DEATH let alone reach the last four.
Coming Up in World Cup Qualifying Slotted into Group 9 alongside Scotland, Norway, Macedonia FYR, and Iceland.
Romania qualified for the finals in 1984, 1996 and 2000. They were knocked out by Hungary in a replayed quarter final in 1972.
How they qualified Romania’s only loss came against Bulgaria after qualification had been secured. Romania won Group G and finished three points better than the Netherlands and four better than Bulgaria. Adrian Mutu was their leading scorer with six goals.
The Coach Victor Piturca played most of his football for Steaua Bucharest and was part of the 1986 European Cup winning side. He was in charge of Romania during the qualifying stages for the 2000 European championships but was fired seven months before the tournament finals after a dispute over the distribution of bonus payments to players. He was recalled as the national team manager to replace Anghel Iordanescu in December 2004.
Key Players There are lots of very good players in this squad but Adrian Mutu who has resurrected his career with Fiorentina after a disastrous spell with Chelsea is the main man for Romania. Mutu often plays in tandem with pacey forward Ciprian Marica who moved to Stuttgart from Shakhtar Donetsk for big money last summer but a return of two goals from 28 appearances (13 as substitute) was poor.
Cristian Chivu made an impressive debut at Euro 2000 as a teenage left back before moving to a central defensive position. But lately Chivu has been providing defensive cover in midfield for the national team and has not looked out of place. Steaua Bucharest stopper Dorin Goian adds some steel at the back but can also pop up with goals at set pieces.
Great Euro Memory Romania failed to win a game at the finals in 1984 and 1996 and the first two games at Euro 2000 only brought a draw and a loss. Facing England in the final game of Group A play in Charleroi Romania needed a win to qualify as runners-up to Portugal while England needed only a draw to progress.
Alan Shearer opened England’s account from the penalty spot just before half time to tie the game at 1-1 after Cristian Chivu has put Romania into the lead. Michael Owen then popped up to give England an unexpected half time lead but right after the break Munteanu leveled the score.
With time running out Philip Neville fouled Moldovan in the penalty area and Ganea struck home the winner from the spot. Italy beat Romania 2-0 in the quarter final through goals from Totti and Inzaghi.
Synopsis This will be Romania’s first appearance at a major final since 2000 but this squad is a very good emerging side that must be cursing its luck after being drawn in the GROUP OF DEATH. However, Romania may be the banana skin that upsets one or even two of the other three teams. This is a side whose chances of making it out of the group should not be underestimated.
Coming Up in World Cup Qualifying Drawn in Group 7 with Austria, France, Serbia, Lithuania and Faroe Islands.
Update - the deal is done and has been announced. For those who can't be bothered hitting a link here is the article.
The Dutch Royal Family, through the lineage of the House of Orange, can trace its roots back to the 1500s to a man called William of Orange - aka William the Silent. He was called the Silent as he rarely spoke out on controversial matters.
However that trait didn’t stop him from instigating a rebellion against Spain that lasted eighty years before independence for the United Provinces was achieved nearly a century after his birth.
William the Silent is still known in the Netherlands as the “Father of the Fatherland” although sometime in the last five hundred years the Dutch decided that they liked the independence bit but silence was just not for them.
Just take a look at the in-fighting and public feuding that has been part of most Dutch national teams for good parts of the last thirty odd years. Some may speculate that a calmer more reasonable demeanor might have brought more success to a country that twice lost to home nations in the World Cup Final while flaming out in numerous European Championships and World Cups.
After all, a single European Championship win in 1988 seems scant reward for a nation that has not only produced some of the world’s greatest players over the last four decades but also some of the most entertaining teams.
However, it might also be argued – and what is wrong the Dutch would argue with a good argument – that it may be the Dutch characteristic of single-mindedness and an appetite to discuss and debate controversial issues that has actually allowed the Dutch game to grow and prosper not only nationally but internationally.
It is easy to forget that less than half a century ago Dutch football was an irrelevance. The country may have made it to the 1934 and 1938 World Cup Finals in Italy and France but the amateur footballers of Holland were there to make up the numbers rather than to compete for the trophy.
The turning point came in the mid-fifties as professional teams were sanctioned followed two years later by the creation of a national league. Even then there was no sudden improvement. In the early sixties the Netherlands lost at home to Luxembourg in the European Championship qualifiers – as it happens the last time the Netherlands lost at home in a European qualifying game.
Success came when the authoritative coaching skills of Rinus Michels crossed paths with the fabulous footballing skills of a young Johan Cruyff. Domestic dominance quickly morphed into European success as Ajax won three successive European Cups between 1971 and 1973. Michels became the first top class Dutch coaching export when he left to coach Barcelona after the first European win. Two years later Cruyff also arrived at the Nou Camp.
Both men joined the Los Angeles Aztecs of the NASL for the 1979 season although the spell was largely without success. After the North American sojourn Michels split his time between the Dutch national team and a couple of Bundesliga teams while Cruyff headed home to Holland after a brief spell with Levante in Spain.
Cruyff’s return was fortuitous as it coincided with the emergence of three players who would go on to become part of one of the late 20th century’s great teams – AC Milan. While Marco Van Basten and Frank Rijkaard came under Cruyff’s influence upon his return to Ajax it was not the same for Ruud Gullit.
Gullit had been approached by Ajax as a youngster but the deal was never done. Instead he joined Haarlem before moving to Feyenoord as a 20-year-old in 1982. A year later Dutch football was shocked when Cruyff turned down a contract extension at Ajax and instead opted to join their great rivals Feyenoord. At Feyenoord Gullit was to learn from the master-craftsman.
Later that decade, Van Basten, Rijkaard and Gullit played under Michels in the 1988 European Championship wining side and were signed by Milan’s ambitious owner Silvio Berlusconi.
Berlusconi saw in the three Dutch players a way by which Milan could again dominate Italy and Europe. It worked like a charm and the Milan side with the Dutch trio remains the last team to win back to back European titles. Before their arrival at the San Siro Milan had not won Serie A for almost a decade and the European Cup for nearly 20 years.
But as a player Gullit was never backward about coming forward and was never on Christmas card terms with Fabio Capello or for that matter #### Advocaat. In 1994 Gullit walked out on Advocaat’s Dutch squad just days before the World Cup finals in the USA in 1994.
Injuries took their toll on Gullit and he bounced from Milan to Sampdoria then back to Milan before finally arriving at Stamford Bridge in July 1995. It was a move that reinvigorated the Dutchman and at 33-years-old he was still good enough to finish as runner-up to Eric Cantona as the Premiership Player of the Year.
Glenn Hoddle, the man who signed Gullit, resigned to take the England job in 1996 and the Dutchman was appointed as player-manager to replace him.
The first season in charge brought Chelsea a FA Cup and Gullit became the first non-British manager to win a major English trophy. The year after with his side sitting second in the league and in the last eight of two cup competitions “cuddly” Ken Bates sensationally fired the man who had brought silverware to Stamford Bridge for the first time in 26 years.
To this day it is still unclear as the reasons behind Bates’ actions.
A brief and largely unhappy stint at Newcastle ended after he benched local legend Alan Shearer. Even so Newcastle still made it to the FA Cup Final during his time there only to lose 2-0 to the treble winning Manchester side of 1999.
A period of five years then lapsed before Gullit again took the managerial reins, this time he returned to Feyenoord for the 2004/05 season but a fourth place finish was much below expectations.
So what can the LA Galaxy and fans of MLS teams expect from Ruud Gullit. First of all they are getting a man with the sort of instant credibility that comes from being one of the great players of his generation. His strength, speed, power, skill and tactical acumen made him the consummate modern player. As a player he was recognized around the world.
Some may describe his managerial record as poor or mediocre but that would be harsh. He won the FA Cup with Chelsea (in the days when Chelsea never won anything) and they were well positioned when he was fired. When put in the context of the time his spell time at Chelsea was a success.
The Newcastle job chewed him up and spat him out. The halcyon days of Kevin Keegan had given way to a brief spell under Kenny Dalglish that finished acrimoniously. Under Gullit Newcastle still reached the FA Cup Final (the only team to reach two consecutive finals and lose both times to teams that completed domestic doubles) but a poor start the following season combined with issues in his private life brought his time to an end after only a year. Although Newcastle could not be considered a success it might be more accurate to describe it as a work in progress prematurely terminated.
Certainly the return of the prodigal son to Feyenoord failed to achieve instant success. The Galaxy will be getting a coach that has had some short sharp managerial lessons administered but by now they should have sunk in.
They’re getting a man who can relate to the Beckham circus having been regarded as a god by Milan fans during his playing days and one that is media savvy.
Probably most importantly they are getting a manager who will not be distracted by the media focus on the Galaxy’s most important investment and who understands that no matter how much media attention, the Galaxy, like every other professional sports team, is in the results business.
It will also have not escaped Gullit’s notice that he will be following in the footsteps of two giants of the game who have also been two of his greatest influences - Michels and Cruyff.
Twenty-eight years ago the Dutch duo joined a league that was hemorrhaging money and was destined for extinction. Even though Michels was a pioneer who showed the world what Dutch coaching could offer, nothing registered in North America.
But the rest of the globe took notice and you have only to look at the 2006 World Cup in which Leo Beenhakker, Guus Hiddink and #### Advocaat all coached other countries to understand how highly valued and appreciated Dutch coaching is.
But with the exception of Thomas Rongen, MLS has to date not fallen under Dutch influence. Now Gullit, a Dutch football Crown Prince, has been presented with a chance to resurrect his managerial career and to perhaps leave a mark on the game in North America in a way that his royal footballing forefathers could not.
The Ruud Gullit File Born Sept 1, 1962, in Amsterdam.
Club Career Haarlem 1978-1982 Feyenoord 1982-1985 PSV Eindhoven 1985-1987 Milan 1987-1993 Sampdoria 1993-1994 Milan 1994-1995 Sampdoria 1995 Chelsea 1995-98
471 games, 174 goals.
International Career Netherlands, 66 caps, 16 goals.
Honours Dutch Second Division 1981 Eredivisie 1984, 1986, 1987 Dutch Cup 1984 Serie A 1988, 1992, 1993 Coppa Italia 1994 Italian Super Cup 1988, 1992, 1994 Champions League 1989, 1990 European Super Cup 1990 Intercontinental Cup 1990 FA Cup 1997 European Championship 1988
Managerial Career Chelsea 1996-1998 1997 Won FA Cup; 6th in Premiership. Newcastle United 1998-1999 1999 FA Cup Runners Up; 13th in Premiership Feyenoord 2004-2005 Finished 4th in Eredivisie
Claudio Ranieri on England’s demise and the issue of three central midfield players.
Michael Grant takes a look at the life and times of Sven Goran Eriksson’s time in charge of England.
Martin Jol has a look at the art of World Cup man management and he also provides some insight on the Ruud van Nistelrooy – Marco van Basten bust-up.
and a bit of fun...it might not be the best day to become a Brazilian but this website translates your name into “Brazilian”. I came out as # 5 - McMahisco. By using a couple of variables for my first name such as Bob I also got McMahildo and Robbiisco.
I will be watching the Good, the Bad and the Ugly tonight. The Clint Eastwood classic not today’s highlights.
Again thanks to all of you who take the time to visit the blog and to those of you who share your thoughts and opinions.
As the dust finally settles after the World Cup equivalent of the Gunfight at the OK Corral another question surfaces – why was Ruud van Nistelrooy still on the bench while Dirk Kuyt started, and Jan Vennegoor of Hesselink came on as a substitute?
Has van Nistelrooy suddenly become so poor that he has plummeted below Kuyt and JV of H in the Dutch pecking order?
His record during the group stage was:
Serbia and Montenegro Started but replaced by Dirk Kuyt after 69 minutes
Ivory Coast Started and scored a goal but replaced by Danny Landzaat 73 minutes.
Argentina Started but replaced by Ryan Babel 56 minutes.
So how do you go from the first choice striker – albeit one who is replaced in the second half of all three group games – to not even seeing any action in a must one game against a side that at various times is up a goal but down a man?
Of course the issue is complicated by his fall out with Sir Alex Ferguson at Old Trafford and likelihood that RVN will be changing his place of business come the new season.
There has been mention of tactical situations but I’m not sure that the explanation holds water given the desperate nature of the game against Portugal. Maybe at the kick off, but when you have the kind of possession that the Dutch enjoyed late in the game, who would you want on the park Hesselink or van Nistelrooy? (For what it is worth did Kuyt show anything to indicate that he is worth the fee that has supposedly being placed on him?)
It would seem to me that one is beyond tactics and the only explanation is van Nistelrooy and Marco van Basten must have had “words” and severe ones at that. I had expected RVN to arrive at the WC ready to take out his club frustrations on other countries.
Apart from a decent first half against Serbia and Montenegro and the chance he put away against the Ivory Coast he looked out of sorts and lacking sharpness.
The Dutch midfield missed a match-fit Rafael van der Vaart and although the passed the ball nicely in midfield there was few penetrating passes into the penalty box – the kind RVN feasts on.
I am the soccer analyst for the Fox Soccer Report and appear twice a week - every Monday and Friday at 10:00 EST. I have also been a regular contributor to the Fox Soccer Channel website since the summer of 2004. Over the last twenty years I have contributed to various radio and television programs throughout North America as well writing about the game for newspapers, magazines and websites.
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