To Venti, Mas and anyone else that has been in a slinging match with me for the last few days .......apoligies... want to leave it behind and get on with the new season... Italy as ive said many times deserved the cup and Canavarro deserved the golden boot.
Question for you Bobby... do you think the crony's at FIFA can do anything to rectify this over the next four years.... Just got through reading some stories about Rugby matches in South Africa and people dying afterwards in pub brawls... should make for an interesting WC
Problem: Time wasting: Players are constantly down injured on the field, and take too long putting the ball in play, when they have a favorable result. Reyes received a yellow card in the 38th minute of the first half for time wasting against Juventus this year!
Solution: Match clock is the most obvious solution. Furthermore refs shouldn’t stop play unless a player is severely injured. If he is a few yards from the sideline, or has an injury which doesn’t impede him from walking, he should walk off. Play was suspended for several minutes in the WC final to tend to Zidane’s shoulder 10 yards from the sideline. That makes no sense at all. Players shouldn’t be expected to kick the ball out of play to tend to injured players, but should take advantage of their numerical superiority.
Problem: Diving: In most cases a dive is either the accentuation of a minor foul which the ref will otherwise not detect, or a striker taking advantage of a mistake by the defender. Diving is very subjective and also difficult for refs on the field to see, as well as being very common in football just because of the nature of the sport. When you see a player fall gracefully to the ground, it is usually a dive, because as we all know, there is nothing graceful about being tripped. This happens in all games and in all sports where there is physical contact.
.. continues ...
Last edited by Venti_vidi_vici on July 13th at 5:55 AM.
Solution: FIFA is not very concerned with this because they understand that is a part of physical sports, and most fouls are subjective (rather than black/white situations). Punishing repeat offenders after watching video replays could be a start, but then do you also punish repeated shirt pulling and holding, or for insulting strikers who dive!? (see Zidane v Materazzi) Cracking down on diving will only give defenders free reign to be more aggressive and stifle attractive play even more. I would also like to see the sliding tackle abolished whereby a player must be on his feet to tackle a player. That’s a bit drastic but would make play far more fluid and less aggressive.
Problem: Negative approach: Teams are rewarded for ties and winning very boring games.
Solution: Restrict the offside to the region close to the penalty area to stop defenses pushing up so high and crowding the midfields to the point where they look like a mosh pit. No points for a tie, and if necessary some sort of a penalty shootout to award the point, or maybe even zero points to both.
Last edited by Venti_vidi_vici on July 13th at 5:59 AM.
Nice posts. I hadn't heard the idea of restricting the offsides area before, I'll have to think about it.
You make interesting points regarding diving. I think there should be some way to punish players retroactively for going to ground when they weren't touched (a.k.a. Ronaldo's two-footed leap while looking at the referee).
Also, there should be a lengthy suspension for grabbing another player's nipple (Materazzi)!
Ahh, the classic nipple foul!! lol
I'm sure that in his three and a half matches Materazzi grabbed about everything there was to grap on opponents and team mates alike.
You guys should check out my blog about diving.
2 things to add that I would like to see eventhough i'm sure it will never happen.
1st: If a player is injured and stays on the ground and must be taken out, then I feel he should have to remain out for a minimum of 5 minutes. Too often these players are flopping around like their leg is broken but then come right back into the game. Let their team suffer a bit for their antics. I'm sure if they know they have to sit on the sideline for 5 minutes they think twice about staying on the ground.
2nd: PKs should only be rewarded when the last defender takes down the striker at any point in the field, even out side the box. A regular foul, thats not a real scoring chance, in the box should not warrant a PK. A foul in the box should be a corner. I think players wouldn't dive as much in the box if they know it won't result in a pk. And Refs would be more inclined to call regular fouls in the box b/c it then won't mean a pk for the ofensive team.
The article and the subsequent posts have really raised some good points and subsequent ideas for change. I really do think the rules need to be tinkered with to open the game to allow more possibilities for scoring and to lessen the effects of cheating and gamesmanship, which slows the flow of games. That being said, the issues being discussed seem much more evident in WC play, than in the regular league play such as the EPL. Subsequent video review and punishment seems quite reasonable. And the feigning of injury and the faux "sportsmanship" of returning the ball to the offending side, after a player writhing in pain is now on the right side of the ball, after a miraculous recovery, which has often stymied a counterattack is just ridiculous. That idea has outlived it's usefulness, and what probably started out as a concept of good sportsmanship is now being abused to the detriment of the game. The idea of an imposed time penalty for players who make remarkable recoveries is a good one.
Ico_79:
You make a couple of excellent points. Not having to award a penalty for a shirt pull, would allow refs to award more freekicks in these cases, instead of them all going against the attacking team. However, I think a freekick from the edge of the penalty area would be more appropriate I agree with awarding a penalty (maybe instead of the red card) for any foul on a player clear through on goal. I think if a player can walk off the field by himself for treatment, he may come right back. But, if you are unable to walk, you shouldn't be fit to play in less than 60 seconds.
Not to beat a dead horse, but in an earlier thread a poster raised the issue of the dichotomy of an apology without regret. To me, the idea of the concept of an apology and regret are mutually inclusive. Zidane apologizes to children world wide, but then insinuates that if one is goaded enough then one has but no choice to seek retribution. Leaving us with the impression that if he had to do it over, the results would be the same. This sends a confused and convoluted message, particularly to children. Certainly, the paramount point is that players aren't allowed to violently attack another player for any reason, and certainly a provocation which consists of mere words is never enough reason. Zidane seems to disagree with the premise.
Once there was agreement that the insults weren't racial or political in nature, my belief is that Materazzi's goading and probable vile comments snookered Zidane in a tactic of ultimate gamesmanship. While we can look into reducing cheating such as shirt pulling and diving,but getting the referees or authorities to start trying to parse insults on the field play or trying to enforce a code of conduct about what can and cannot be said, outside of obvious racial or hate speech, would be tremendously difficult. So, while French people and some others may rally around there hero, Zidane (which may be quite natural), he really has brought shame upon himself and football for most in the rest of the world, unless you prescribe to the notion of any publicity is good publicity.
Last edited by Skavenjer on July 13th at 10:15 AM.
Mas, Gong, Venti, Ico .... I want to appoligise to you if i have made any comments to any of you personally ..... cetain remarks by Odin tended to make my blood boil and thus type things at times too personal. Diving issues i still strongly want to get out of the game by all countries and would love it if FIFA would grow the balls needed to implement something to remove it
Unrelated topic, but I'd like to hear some comments on the Scottish champs Celtic getting absolutely schooled by DC United. The 4-0 scoreline flattered them judging from the highlights I found on Youtube (why wasn't this game on FSC, btw?).
I love to watch MLS teams face off against well known clubs from around the world. FSC should try to show all these matches, if possible.
Regarding Celtic ... I really don't make anything of it. It's very tough for players to get up for matches like these. The World Cup just ended, it's the beginning of a long, grueling season. Gordon Strachan wrote a few months ago how he detested having to go on pre-season North American tours.
They say it's a way for the players to "bond," but the money don't hurt.
Aussie:
No apology necessary. You seem to be a passionate football supporter just like the rest of us, opinionated and biased. Your team played four good games in this WC and could’ve even progressed further. It was a harsh way to get eliminated, and if that had happened to my team I may have smashed the TV. In fact, UEFA still gets hate mail from me after the disallowed goal by Sheva against Barca three months ago.
Diving and intentional time wasting are definitely two of the most frustrating aspects of football, and when you’re watching your team suffer these wrongs, it can be maddening. Simulation and accentuation are simply part of contact sports and exist in all of them. Clamping down on diving would allow defenders to be even more aggressive and reckless, and would give them an added advantage. That’s basically why pro sports, FIFA included, have always let it go.
Again, it’s fun exchanging opinions and the occasional jibe with all of you.
Having only just become a "Bloggy" I have looked at some of the feedbacks and have to say that I have been lifted by David Ellarys comments. I have been screaming for these type of punishments to cheaters for so long, that to hear david come out and echo my sentiments, and those of many football fans I am sure, was pure joy. I have said for a long time, (check my blog at Crapshoot) especially seeing what was happening at the WC, that kicking the ball out of play should be stopped. If a team wants to have their downed player looked at they can make the decision to kick the ball out, knowing they will not get the ball back.
Only the ref should be able to stop the game.
I can only hope that FIFA actually listen to commonsense for once. As they certainly did not use any in the WC.
I read your comments in regard to the diving and cheating, time wasting etc, and just wanted you to know that from my experience, football is the only sport whereby cheating is a major factor in the sport. I moved from London to the USA a few years ago, and started watching some of the USA sports, such as the NFL, Basketball etc, I can tell you that there is little or no cheating in these major sports. In the NFL they slam into each other with major force, but I have never seen a player roll around trying to gain an advantage.
The beauty of the games here is that in the two main sports, American Football and Basketball, the clock stops when the play ends. In baseball there is no advantage to time wasting, so it simply does not happen. But my main point, is that football is the only sport I know that cheats prosper.
The solution is as David Ellary states in his recent article (ex referee) that after match fines, bans, use video evidence post match, stop the situation whereby a player goes down and the opposition kicks the ball out. This should stop, it has become simple gamesmanship, or cheating is a better name.
I have lived and breathed football as I think most of us here ahve, all my life, but I ahve never been so ashamed of our sport as I was in the WC. To make matters worse I had to sit amoungst Americans who laughed at our sport as a joke.
Even in the very physical sport of Rugby, it is still played by gentlemen. I have a motto for this coming season on my blog "PUNISH THE CHEATS NOT THE FANS"
Great comments Venti, thx
Last edited by Crapshoot on July 25th at 12:07 PM.
Bobby, I just got this really surprising news about the 2010 world cup final referees. This seemed a good a place as any to let you know. I put it om my blog.
Probably needs checking out, but if it turns out to be true, you might want to talk about it on FSW report (at least the sponsorship part).
(click the picture)
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